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Please give me likes so I can DM people :D :D
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Soooo can we talk about the Maxwell verdict
Chief
Enthusiast
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Bowl Leader
Please give me likes so I can DM people :D :D
Bowl Leader
Soooo can we talk about the Maxwell verdict
Chief
Most law firms are not kind and gentle environments and many do not have the best culture because people tend to be super busy, competitive, overwhelmed, type A and stressed out.
You’re going to get a little outburst or snarky comment now and then from partners or senior associates, etc. And someday you’ll probably let one slip too without even knowing. Usually it’s just stress manifesting itself. For all you know, the guy had just fought with his wife, got a shitty ruling on a motion, lost a prospect, hasn’t slept well, etc. sometimes it’s not personal and associates are just easy targets.
To quote a favorite tv character: “shit runs downhill. Money goes up. It’s that simple.”
It happens. Suck it up, clear it out, and keep on keepin on
Thanks - Even a broken clock gets it right twice a day.
Looking back, it was actually hard to read situations and figure this stuff out without a mentor. Most associates don’t have them.
Chief
Agree. We need more context to comment.
Well I mean, he could have been nicer about it. Just avoid him down the road. Is this your first time working with him?
Only if it’s true. It’s pretty easy to know if you’re lying. Not sure how staffing works at your firm or how big it is, but I find partners I like working with, kill it for them, and then solicit them for work or they latch on. It’s not easy and there’s no 100% avoiding it. But generally, yes that’s how I do it.
“Sorry, I’m pretty capped out at the moment and I don’t have capacity to get these to you in the timeframe/shape you want it. I have XYZ in the pipeline.”
I had a partner make a similar comment to me as a first year associate. I felt horrible after. Here’s my recommendation: (1) don’t let this make you afraid to ask questions - it did for me initially and I wish it hadn’t. (2) To the extent you can in the future, make your questions specific and/or option based. (3) If you get to a point where you’re stuck on something & just can’t figure out a good approach say that (ex. “I’ve spent [amount of time] on this & I feel like I’m spinning my wheels on X issue. Any recommendations for how to handle?”) Partners don’t want you to waste billable time - if you’re stuck, call it out - otherwise try to figure out your own approach before you reach out. Hang in there, OP - you’ve got this! If you generally like what you’re doing, don’t let one insensitive comment push you out.
Do need context but generally I might say that until you talk to this partner and are sure you’ve shared your concerns and perspective on this issue then not yet time to leave the firm.
I asked a question on whether partner wanted an x item in his brief, partner responded with “stop expecting others to find the answers for you”
This is my comment on another post but there were other situations that led to this one being the final straw. I’ll be happy to answer any questions you may have if you want to PM me.
https://joinfishbowl.com/comment_47p5kd
Chief
It wasn’t a nice way to make his point but I do think you’re being over sensitive. He’s trying time get you to think through things for yourself rather than just doing what you’re told and needing detailed instructions for every part of every task. He should have said something like “I’d like to see you think like a lawyer for our client, not my assistant. What do you think is best?”
My thoughts exactly. I like to think I’m made of thick skin but statements like these leave me hoping for a change in this profession.
It’s always hard to judge the partners actual mind set based on email. Emails tend to always come off harsh. Especially if you sent this to him off hours, you are more likely to get a “go away figure it out” response. Best thing to do is find a time to talk to him, if wtf video chat him during work hours. If he is actually angry you will figure that out real fast lol. You could also figure out a “why” so you can avoid/correct it in future. If he is unreasonable and a partner I am sure you aren’t going to be the first to figure it out. Older associates and/or mentors help there too
Chief
Now if you hate the work overall then time to move on but if it’s only one jerk-don’t.
I think you’re being oversensitive. It isn’t a campfire it’s a business. Error on the side of giving the information and let the partner cut it down. If you’re looking for kinder gentler etc., I would say let that idea go, take the comment as a partner who wants to see you think for yourself, and knows you can.
I worked for a very difficult partner for over a year and a half. He had this weird possessiveness over me. Anytime the firm would try to move me to a new partner (their doing, not my request) and give him a different associate, he would insist that I continue to work for him. The other partners eventually gave up because his happiness was more important than an associate’s growth. I ultimately left because I felt like I had plateaued and he wouldn’t let me grow as an associate. I also grew very tired of the all hours emails (no other partner or associate operated that way at the firm) and his never ending snarky comments.
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Can you describe what happened? I guess answer will depend upon what actually happened
Post the email?
I prefer when associates frame the question that gives me options to consider. For example, here are the pros and cons of putting this particular argument in the brief. If you just ask, “do you want x in the brief?” It gives the impression that you haven’t given it any thought, and you want the partner to just tell you what to do.