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This isn’t endemic to all firms, it’s not normal, and it’s not ok; it’s abuse.
I spent my first three years of practice working for someone who regularly screamed at me. As soon as the market opened up I started looking for another job, and landed where I am now. My current boss one time told me that I was like a kicked puppy when I first started working there. I’ve never been yelled at since, and I became a MUCH better lawyer learning under people who used praise and constructive criticism as a training method. I have never looked back. Run for the hills - that behavior won’t change, it’s abusive, and you won’t learn under it.
Happened to me when I was a first year. I yelled back. He never yelled at me again.
I may have yelled back...this is the first time she's screamed at me so I wanted to set the precedent
I’ve been an attorney for going on 8 years now. I’ve screwed up. You know how a boss is supposed to handle that? Make sure I know I that I screwed up and make sure I know that I’m responsible for fixing it to the extent possible. No need for screaming, ever. We are a profession of perfectionists, we beat ourselves up plenty. I have never been screamed at and I would never stand for it simply because it is so unprofessional and creates a gross dynamic with you and your boss. As if our profession doesn’t have enough problems with mental health and substance abuse, we’re supposed to accept being screamed at too? No way. Also who wants to fess up to a mistake when that will be the likely result? Really bad management skills creating a potentially really bad situation for the client and the firm.
I responded down below too, but I really agree with this - the position I was in when this happened was during the Great Recession, and I was terrified to leave because my cohort was being fired left and right and there was nowhere to go. I waited as long as it took for the market to open up again, and moved immediately after. I found another job fairly quickly then - the bonus to surviving a downturn is that most firms will know you’re valuable if you made it through in one piece.
Screaming is unprofessional and should NEVER be accepted.
Do you have a firm ethics officer?
I would express my concern that if this person in power loses it with one of their own staff, that there may be a matter of real concern ethics wise (and firm liability wise) and that you are following your own required ethics of doing something about it by bringing this up internally instead of directly to the state bar.
Do you think abuse (and abuse of power) is ethical?
Would you accept this in a courtroom?
3rd year here. My practice group leader yells/screams all the time. Sometimes at us, sometimes at support staff, sometimes at his computer... we think it’s kind of funny most of the time. A grown man acting like a child. Don’t let it get under your skin.
At a really big firm that’s generally known as pretty cutthroat and no one has EVER yelled at me or anyone else in my class. Not so much as even an annoyed tone - everyone’s always very nice.
I have been practicing 32 years. I have never screamed at an associate. I have been screamed at on several occasions, but it was by opposing counsel in the midst of depositions when he was losing control of his witnesses. I have only been screamed at by men.
(I'm inclined to take my coworker's opinion that it happens everywhere with a grain of salt because he's...not a great lawyer, but I'm curious)
Rising Star
This hasn’t happened to me and I’m a fifth year. It may be my bosses’ operating style is more laid back/hands off, and we do get into disagreements, but I’m sorry you had to deal with that. Some partners can fly off the handle without hearing themselves
Second year here and this has never happened to me. I’ve heard a Partner raise their voice a little, but never yelling or screaming.
Ok, same at my old job! I knew when my judge was annoyed, but he didn't loose sight of the fact that we were all just at work
I would rather deal with a screaming partner than one that shushes you. I’ve had that experience, a lot. The ones that shush you are likely very sneaky.
4th year Corp associate - never been screamed at. I’ve certainly had partners get frustrated with me or been scolded for an error, but everything has been handled very professionally. (Door closed, stern talking to but no raised voices) I understand that people get overwhelmed, but screaming at coworkers the way you described is NEVER okay.
The degree and tone of how he talked to you is obviously important. I am willing to accept criticism for mistakes and understand my mistake could frustrate a boss, but I am also an adult and wouldn’t tolerate being treated as anything less. Healthy boundaries are important in all relationships.
What did you do....lol
Yeah. I used to work for a screamer who regularly yelled at everyone in the group. He is really smart, an aggressive litigator, and good at his job. But he's an old guy from NYC who thinks screaming and being a jerk is acceptable. Everyone used to duck him and he would actually feel proud when associates were scared of him. I wound up on his bad side for a year and spent the whole time thinking I would get fired while I was looking for another job. I finally dug out of it, just in time to tell him I was leaving. I still don't think he knows why I wanted to leave. When I was looking for a new job, I made sure to find a place that did not have screamers. No screamers at my current firm and they focus on keeping it that way. That's a place I want to be partner.
Screaming is humiliating and is abuse. I've been there and tolerated my boss for way longer than I should have. Despite how good you are at your job, no matter how confidently you lead your life, the abuse at work messes with your head. The sooner you get out the better. Once I got out, it's never been repeated and I'll never tolerate it again. Lesson learned.
What practice area, OP?
OP I worked for a solo my first 7 years, he yelled constantly, and as it was just him, me, and one assistant most of the time (others rotated through and left because he was intolerable) there was no one to complain to. I tried to leave once for a govt job and they called to check my employer (even though I asked them to call me first if they were going to) and he blew up. I should have left but I feel like my field is an old boys network and he's 80 and knows everyone so burning the bridge wouldn't help. And leaving him in the lurch would have absolutely burned the bridge. I wish I had something like this back then to hear from others telling me to get out.
another attorney who has never been screamed at in 8 years
I’ve heard an unconfirmed story that was very similar to yours where the attorney who is yelled at went back into the office shortly have to and said, “I’m not getting paid enough to get yelled that screamed that, so we can do one of two things: I can either leave now or we can agree you won’t yell at me like that again.”
In the version of the story I heard, the partner changed his ways.
Idk if I’d have the nerve to do it though unless you have a bit of savings to rely on while you look for a new job but I think there’s a lot to be said for the self respect you’ll earn by doing it.