My manager recently told me she would soon add “Senior” to my title. (I have been working here for 4 years) but she mentioned the addition of “Senior” likely will not come with a pay raise, or even any official change as far as Spotify is concerned. still waiting to know for sure, but I’m thinking if she does propose this I will politely refuse and say “I don’t want a title change that doesn’t really mean anything. I’ll accept if it comes with a meaningful change” thoughts?

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i’d take the title change as it’d be great for your resume. i’d only refuse if they’re giving you more responsibilities/work with no pay raise

likesmarthelpful

Honestly I would take the title shift, because it could be harmful to your career to look like you haven’t been promoted in four years.

And start looking for another job, either with another team or at a different company.

It sounds like they are unwilling to meaningfully recognize your hard work and contributions

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Agree with this very much, time to update your resume and LinkedIn with the new title and go hunting.

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The empty title might help you negotiate better pay when you leave for a company that offers more than empty titles under the guise of advancement.

likeupliftingsmart

Token promotions in title alone are retention efforts in my experience; they don't want you to leave, but they don't want to do anything material to that end. Sometimes the intentions are genuine but the resources don't exist yet to truly expand your role and sometimes they really are just hoping to string you along. You are in the best position to know what their motive is. My response would be dependent on that and whether my role was still challenging as is. In either case I'd accept the fake promotion, but in the latter case I'd start looking for opportunities elsewhere.

likesmart

I’m a manager there and this doesn’t sound right - what’s your current title?

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I’ll DM you

Great advice, everyone ! Thank you! Sounds like I should take the title bump and try to expand it some way (internally or externally) there are a few other opportunities for me to possibly get a ‘real’ promotion in the next few months, so I’ll keep working hard to make those happen and make myself an obvious candidate for a new role

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I think asking for a pay raise + increased leadership role in addition to the title change is a fair ask. However, if that ask is not met, I would still take on the “title change”...because that is leverage you can use to negotiate higher pay + increased leadership at another company.

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UPDATE - Good news! After discussing this further with my manager, she learned more about the Spotify promotion process and I’m filling out a form to have this considered up the official Spotify chain of command. I feel much more confident that this will result in a significant pay raise and real title change. Should find out in Feb if I’ll get it. Thanks for all your help!

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I think it’s a great opportunity for you to bring up compensation raise and gives you some time to prepare for the conversation. You don’t necessarily need to say no. The title may help you in the future for new roles within or outside of Spotify.

Have you recently received a raise?

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I got a 3% raise last year at beginning of year

"Restructuring the job ladder". In my experience, translates to: How can the company cut ✂️ without having PR uproar.

likesmart

Having senior in the title may help externally, but I find that nobody really cares about your title until you hit director (everything up to senior is treated as pretty much the same)

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I know I'm a little late to the game, but it my mind, there are three forms of compensation:
* title
* new responsibilities
* economic considerations (salary, equity, etc)

I will always accept any of the three and don't need them to be connected with the others. Especially as your compensation gets to be more and more satisfactory, the other two become proportionately more important. The reason is that, by changing companies, you can often leverage them to get more compensation than any company is going to give you as part of their basic year-to-year pay increase scheme. Also, you can use them to make career pivots or to skip up the food chain within or while changing companies. You can't do that with compensation. Comp increases also, mathematically and economically, become less significant as your compensation goes up. The only way to keep the comp increases proportionately more valuable is to have that title and responsibility growth.

In short, in the initial scenario (I know things have changed, and congrats, that's awesome!) I would have warmly accepted the title change and then started looking for a new company. Happily, Spotify doesn't seem dumb. 😂🙌

likesmart

Are they restructuring the job ladder?

likehelpful

No

I wouldn’t decline the title bump, I’d just make the case for it to accompany a pay raise. Don’t know the situation but under normal circumstances that makes no sense. Titles are tied to salary brackets.

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OP a good conversation to have (a part from working hard) is communicating your expectations for professional trajectory with your manager, asking for specific goals/milestones you need to hit to get that promotion to hold them accountable to the company’s roles and responsibilities. I’m sure you’ve done so already but just wanted to share since I’ve had my headaches over the same thing.

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I'm completely against title bumps without any compensation tied to it. I've even rejected a bonus or have asked to cap my own raise to keep team members properly compensated (don't judge, budget was tight).

However absurd this is, it's not uncommon, and in my experience the most common occurrence is either a ladder/positioning restructuring, you were already overpaid for your title (not fair, I know, but it happens); and as some mentioned before, budget constraints.

Anyway, take the bump give it a bit and start shopping around on LinkedIn. The Sr title plus coming from Spotify will open you many doors.

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I would just take it, even if with additional responsibilities. The more slice you've in the work the more you grow.

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My only advice it to be clear on whatever new expectations come with the new title and you are comfortable in that new role.

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From my experience, “Senior” is a cop out for not promoting staff to the next level. Don’t accept that response. Take the better title even without pay, over the “Senior” nonsense.

Yes- adding to the title should mean something... but not sure I would turn it down for the above stated reasons.

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