{ "media_type": "text", "post_content": "Thoughts?", "post_id": "60f2048e1e1426002b9b4d2e", "reply_count": 103, "vote_count": 11, "bowl_id": "552d1d24dc1c586b09d2d052", "bowl_name": "Law" }

Thoughts?

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likefunny
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I continue to be confused by these all or nothing attitudes. I love WFH. I am more efficient, I’m a better lawyer, and I’m healthier both physically and mentally when I work from home. Sure, there are benefits to working with others in the office. But we do not have to be in the office five days a week to realize those benefits. Hybrid models where people are in the office three days a week or so are and should be the future. You can get the benefits of remote work and in-person work. It’s not all or nothing.

likesmart

People in favor of wfh are probably not saying no one should be allowed in the office or go when they need to. I’m certainly not. Just don’t tell me I have to be in the office for my own development or whatever x days a week. I’m happy to go in as necessary - we’re all professionals.

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In an era where attorneys are expected to bill 8 hours a day, plus commute, AND they are more accessible out of the office than their boomer managing partners ever were (cell phones and laptops mean you can work anywhere at any time, and they expect you to) the ability to work remote most of the week is one of the ways firms need to meet their associates in the middle. Have some mandatory office days, sure. But allow WFH. The attorney job is more demanding than it has ever been before due to technology. Long overdue to start making it work for us.

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How would he know if outside attorneys are working from home? What a weird controlling thing to demand.

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My guess is that they tried to do it with their own people and it backfired spectacularly, so they’re trying to leverage it with their suppliers too

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MS’s real estate portfolio must be down real bad

likefunnysmart

This 💯

I actually agree, sorry ya’ll no way can people be 100% remote and thrive in an apprenticeship model profession. And I say this fucking hating going into the office.

likeuplifting

Does Morgan Stanley pay each lawyer involved for an inter-offfice conference? If not, it is a bit hypocritical to expect lawyers to do things for which you refuse to pay them.

likefunny

I hate when clients demand things of law firms that have 0 impact on them. Let people do what they want if it isn’t hurting anyone (and actually, the work might be better…)

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Lol what’s next? Telling the law firms who to hire?

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Yep

The man has a theory that in-office firms will have a leg up. I’m willing to test it - I’ll be the control group working from home.

likefunny

None of his outside firms will be 100% work from home. All of them occasionally worked outside the office (if not frequently did so). He’ll also never know where they’re actually working. None of them will be ever refuse to meet in person for a critical meeting. So he’s looking for a problem that doesn’t exist. Beyond that, he’s not entirely wrong on some of his points but he’s basically whining about a non-issue. That, of course, won’t stop large firms that represent MS from acting like it’s the word of God coming from Sinai, but I’m not working in the office just because the client says so.

likefunny

Thank god my firm doesn’t represent MS.

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Fuck that guy.

likefunny

Haha when I said this my idea was reported by a boomer

likefunny

K boomer

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Eric Grossman can EAD

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Morgan Stanley probably has a lot of money in commercial real estate. 😂

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What a dick move

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That’s gross, man

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I see what you did there. 😂

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Why tf does he care…..MYOB.

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What the heck

likesmart

Currently working on a deal for MS…everyone is remote save one dude in MS’ NYC offices

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They are set to return to office soon I think

So I have noticed that working from home, things do take a bit longer. If I'm billing 2.3 on a task that'd be a 2.2 in office...maybe at that level, those dollars add up.

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AA3: oh sure, but there are a lot of me's with me problems. Maybe those add up. You suggesting I write down my own hours? WC: bold of you to assume the client gives a flying f about our non billable time costs.

100%, this is nothing but butthurt from an attorney who went in house and took a paycut for it, justified by the better work life balance, and now he is salty that the next generation of private lawyers will keep their private pay while WFH.

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A26 and Counsel both have valid points. I attended a meh law school. Straight out of law school, I was offered several positions for 40k (Chicago, 2017 for reference). I declined those offers because I did NOT go to law school to make what I was making before law school at my prior job. I, instead, got a position with a third party due diligence company, reading contracts for about twice the money. A year into this I moved into a small, boutique law firm. I took a slight pay cut to do this. I800 billable hours. It was a good place to learn but I was doing WAY more than 1800 hours due to being one of a few associates. Then I lucked out and had recruiters reach out to me because of the niche I am in. I (dumb luck) got an offer at big law and lateraled. I’ve been in big law for about 6 months, and it is a different world. However, the recruiter I worked with said something that I think I will always remember. She said, “Only you can take charge of your career path and your career growth.” So while yes, folks in biglaw may not deserve your sympathy when they complain, the blunt truth is that you sound unhappy where you are currently at. And only you can choose to stay there and continue to be unhappy, or you could take control of your career and network/lateral your way into something that is “better”: prestige, money, firm recognition, whatever you think “better” is. You have no sympathy foe biglaw folks living out the reality of their decisions. Not to be harsh, but the other side of that coin is that I don’t really have much sympathy for your current state of career unhappiness. Also, I’m genuinely sorry you have had such terrible things happen (sexual harassment.) there is no excuse for that to be the norm in the legal world.

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The bank's huge commercial real estate clients are desperate for people to return to the office so they are exerting pressure wherever they can to help them - like requiring their law firms to have people back in the office full time for example. I'm sure the same is happening with the accounting firms. they fear that their real estate portfolios will lose money so they are doing whatever they can to grease the wheels. This has nothing to do with the practice of law in person, wfh or otherwise. It is simply an attempt to get people - any people - back into their office buildings.

likesmart

I wouldn’t put it past them. But my intuition is pressuring the firms they work with would have a marginal effect on commercial real estate profits.

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