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I legitimately love my strategy team so much. The ones in my office are some of the smartest people I’ve met. I work more on digital stuff than campaigns, but legitimately don’t understand the hate. They’re smart as hell, they do the work, they pay attention to detail. I’m in UX and I can’t tell you the amount of times their prep work became the talking points that impressed clients the most. We intentionally bring them in for their take on work because they’ve generally done more prep than most of the team (not necessarily the team’s fault, just generally shorter discovery time on fast paced projects). It’s embarrassing to present creative work that hasn’t been vetted by the people who know and understand the tone of voice and the competitive set better than anyone. I feel like my team does so much heavy lifting and I’m sorry other people don’t have the same experience.
Hell yea! We suck!
Only job is to stunt the true potential of so many brilliant creative minds!
I love nothing more than shitting on all of the Cannes-worthy, culture shifting ideas that I see everyday - like ironic streetwear collections and AirBnB collaborations for the 1000th time, no matter the brief.
I go into the office and see my creatives as my competition.
I must win and they must lose.
Fuck collaboration. If they have something interesting, I will quash it so that it never sees the light of day. It will die a slow death in the appendix of a google slides deck, never to be repurposed for another brief in the months and years to come.
I'm a creative but this is still pretty good
What is with all the strategy hate around here?
I don’t think there are very many young strategist available. Sometimes working with my older colleagues - ideas and innovations can feel old or stale. I think there should be more young strategist that can bring innovation to the table!
Things strategists do that annoy me, a strategy director:
1. Care more about the research and the data than the work
2. Complicate things
3. Use three slides to say something that could be said in a sentence
4. Kill / shit on work for any reason other than it feels like it’s off strategy
5. Get precious about stuff that doesn’t matter
Not exactly their fault: that they “weigh in” on the creative along the way and basically just turn into one more opinion, one more person who expects to “be heard” and “make sure the work is right” and its just another cook in the kitchen.
One that is their fault: “I put a page of thought starters in there, so yknow... if you guys ever wanna stop by and chat or just throw ideas around, I used to be a writer, so...yeah whatever, Im around.” And then later “So those thought starters I put in there, just wondering, did you guys, like...did those lead anywhere or...”
Short version: acting like some version of a creative.
BUT I always hasten to add THEY ARE GOOD PEOPLE!
And as we eat our own, our clients continue to lose respect and need for us.
This. Above. They step out of their lane and think that creative is easy, comment without respect for the years of craft it takes to arrive at a campaign. Provide the data and insights and move on. I’m happy clients are beginning to not pay for this service.
Saying that strategists can’t weigh in on creative is as ignorant a position as creatives can’t weigh in on strategy.
The sooner creatives understand that strategy works to sell their beautiful object in to a hesitant client by effectively framing how it addresses their business challenge, the sooner we can all get back to making good work - not needlessly taking shots at one another.
Per my title, I do both and reading through this conjures two thoughts:
1. the traditional agency model is flaming garbage (you all should try working at places that don’t adhere to this binary)
2. Damn if you aren’t all salty af, who hurt you?
I’m a writer and a strategist. I didn’t dip out of copy, I pivoted toward what I consider emerging media. I currently work mostly on digital brand activations and PR stunts (so hot rn), but am also who is tapped for creative concepts and words. Most of my writing is for social.
CW1 Not sure if this helps explain but I work on integrated ideas, same as you. TV is just never on the table. May your career be blessed with many Super Bowls spots.
Planners in our industry today are mostly devoutly progressive and often miss the mark on American culture beyond their urban bubbles. Rarely have I worked with a planner who can isolate an insight from an audience that is not either a stereotype or an observation that sounds cool.
First Rule of Marketing:
Know who you’re talking with.
Second Rule of Marketing:
You’re not that person.
As a middle-aged white guy from Wisconsin,
I remind myself of that constantly.
Funny, but I’ve done a lot of work in Multicultural. Pitched in on Lion-winning stuff. But I take special pride in the success we had on Kotex, whose products I can’t say I was all that familiar with.
One of the fun parts about planning is stepping outside yourself to understand others. If you’re a curious person, this can be a great business.
And if you’re open to others, you can really help the work.
I confess, I have shat on work in the past. you know why? because it was shit.
I've worked all over the world and I've never encountered a more arrogant and insulated bunch of creatives as I have here in the US. no one else is allowed to talk about creative, everyone else is an idiot worthy of public and unrelenting mocking, we must all bow down to the supreme overlord creative director. he who has an opinion on everything, but about whom no one is allowed an opinion. they will allow you to attend creative reviews, but only so you can revel in their brilliance and shower them with praise.
the best offices I've worked in have had seamless and genuine collaboration between all departments, and they've all been in markets that aren't the US. and guess what? they also win way more creative awards than their US counterparts. I wonder how that could be, what with all those feckless idiots "weighing in" with their uneducated opinions on everything.
I guess that's where egos come in. I don't hire people with big egos who think they know it all. I agree, there's no need to say anything if you have nothing to say. your ability to speak impresses no one. but if you have something to say, say it. I have had too many instances of junior people saying nothing and then telling me something genius after the meeting is over. I'd rather they overcame the fear of being wrong and were encouraged to find out if they're wrong or not. I love your quote too, but to me it has more to do with listening than speaking. if you're going to speak because you have to be heard, please don't. but if you've been absorbing the conversation and have something to add, please do.
Can I say something I genuinely feel bad about for Strategists and how theyre used? I think its RIDICULOUS that every single god damn piddly assignment we have is supposed to have “a human insight” or whatever the hell proprietary language.
I worked on Taco Bell long ago. Each...frigging...menu item (and they try a new one every five weeks)...was supposed to have a HUMAN TRUTH. The cheesy burrito: people love melted cheese. The bacon chalupa: people love the smell of bacon. It was HORRIBLE, and it was NOT the strategists fault that in the agencys process, they were expected to slave over the god damn brief and “inspire the team.”
Sometimes the “insight” is that we need some banners that say mattresses are half off all 4th of July Weekend. What’s the “Junior Digital Strategist” supposed to do with that?
Rising Star
Agree with BBDO1. There should be an insight that transcends individual executions, one that connects the consumer to the brand itself, not a BLT sandwich.
I actually love my strategists... sorry y’all are having gripes.
Big Spaceship strategists are something different entirely. They only hire people who can work in true collaboration and don’t suffer from an oversized ego. Culture fit matters A LOT. The “weighing in” doesn’t really happen because of how collaboratively BSS works.
Hey we honestly just want to be good partners and make sure the work is effective. I never want to step on toes, but it’s an everyday challenge to walk that fine line. Every creative needs something different from me and half the job is figuring out what that is. Don’t hate on us. Tell us what you need so we can help you produce meaningful work.
Seconding this. It’s sad to see so much strategy hate because I don’t feel this way about my creative partners. Everything I do is in service of making their work better, whatever that may be.
Would be nice if creatives here would explain what we can do to be more helpful.
I love my strategists. Sorry. ✌️
Could you provide any examples of good propositions they’ve come up with?
I appreciate the work strategists do and haven’t ever had them kill my work or jump in my lane. They create, perhaps, decks that are way too long, but I am an information sponge and get a lot from their research/insights.
It’s rare to see a solid proposition (not to mention an insight). Think strategists should have a portfolio just like creatives.
Love a good strategist. Creative's best friend.
The biggest difference is that creatives become battle weathered to their 'babies' being killed - great ideas chewed apart by a row of mouths. But try killing a strategist's baby... that's a zombie kid that just won't die.
SD1, was just funny how it was delivered. As mentioned, was a little telling. Sure you meant well. Will put one thought your way to think about, advertising has become "say it all, clearly in seconds." Most of the time that's right, but there are some amazing, much loved and awarded examples of not making immediate sense - classic Economist ads, Noma Bar illustrations, Penguin books, Casper. Think about the reward for the viewer when they get it. Solving feels good. The solved message is clear. There's a time and place for it, sure. Striking that balance of too cryptic and just right, isn't always easy. So try seeing this as fun, it's only advertising, and we can play against hard rules of "it must do this."
I’ve never needed strategists. As an account person I just find them getting in the way. A lot of what I do though doesn’t need a huge insight behind it. Then when we do need insights it’s always the same story no matter the problem - busy mom doesn’t have time for herself looking for shortcuts yada yada yada
SD1 - not every project needs a huge strategy. Things don’t shift that dramatically from banner ad to banner ad. Agencies need to be nimble and produce work quickly and effectively. I think the role of a strategist should be more proactive and it would be great if strategists got involved early and provided proactive recommendations. Then they would be seen as a partner. Ps - sending a mass email with insights to all agency doesn’t help much.
I'm just here to see creatives shitting on another team they deem ill qualified to provide opinions. Keep that tea flowing, y'all.
BBDO - screenshoting to share with my creative team so they can laugh at me for another reason today.
not at all. I love entering reviews only to be told by the ECD that this meeting is a dictatorship, that we can say whatever we want but none of it will be entertained as only his opinion matters. I think it makes for a wonderfully healthy work environment.
@ogilvy 🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂
The bad strategists (at least the few ones I've worked with) have this annoyingly cliche way of describing or depicting the target market, like "Linda's a loving mom who wants the best for her family." I mean, is there actually a loving mom who'd want crap for her family?