Why do the ambitious, high achievers who are highly intelligent and interesting (inside and outside of work) always leave public accounting while the mediocre are left behind? I notice this in every firm I’ve worked for.

likefunnysmart
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Because public accounting punishes people who perform well

likesmart

I am a first year manager who has consistently been labeled a high performer. I won't comment on whether I'm intelligent or interesting.

My reward for being a high performer is a constant workload in high pressure situations with limited opportunities to catch my breath. Thinking back to earlier this year.. I already had multiple clients and a full workload, but a need for a manager popped up. This new engagement was fit into my schedule by removing hours from another engagement. Was my workload for that other engagement reduced? No, but the hours I had allocated to complete that engagement were still reduced.

How is my compensation impacted by me being a high performer year after year? Exclude this year because obviously the pandemic/cuts. As a senior, the difference in salary between an average performer and a high performer was VC of a few percent, and a salary raise of a few percent. To each their own, but while its more money, I don't consider it enough to be worth the extra effort I put in to be considered a higher performer.

The overall result? Im currently looking for new employment.

likesmart

@pwc1 - My rejections worked a few times times and failed a few times. Sure it was successful a few times but in the end, it was a failure cause i got put on a couple extra jobs i said no to anyway

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If you do your job well in PA you get more/harder work and thus are burnt out faster

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That’s why I’m leaving ahhaha

likefunny

As an average performer it’s just so easy to stay and keep getting promoted. I’m a manager/making over 100k/usually getting 10%+ raises without really trying too hard aside from busy season. What’s not to love about that? High performers get the same raise but more work, no thanks.

likeuplifting

PwC1 it is pretty tough to start honestly. My main tip is to be up front when expectations are too high. I push back a lot if I’m given a deadline I don’t feel is realistic. I never like intentionally drop the ball, but I will let people know if what they’re asking is going to require a crazy amount of hours/isn’t realistic.

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As an "old timer" one told me... the high performers leave for better opportunities, the low performers get weeded out pretty quickly,and all that's left at a B4 is average performers.

likesmart

This is the correct answer. No need for more comments on the thread thanks

likesmart

I wouldn't make that sweeping generalization because the firm I left had ambitious and intelligent people.

But...there are easier ways to make good money, that's why they leave

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Yes I’m making a sweeping generalization. But I can’t help notice this in every firm I’ve been in. All of these types of people have left and the reason isn’t just money. They don’t feel fulfillment and want to do something meaningful, the work isn’t challenging or engaging, they hate accounting and want to do something else, they don’t like client service?

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Being a high performer isn’t worth it in public. Just gets you more work. You can work less and make way more elsewhere.

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This right here. Unless your comp is commensurate with your performance (which is extremely rare) you eventually run out of incentives to continue performing which leads to irreversible toxicity and burn out.

Because we get compensated the same as the mediocre people

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Imagine thinking like this all the time. People have families, hobbies, hard and good times in their personal and professional life. It's not easy to classify everyone in three categories and if you find yourself doing it often... Well, that may not be healthy.

like

But isn’t high performer would get higher raise and bonus and also higher chance of being partner?

like

So it’s all relative and takes into account the three factors I mentioned. Depending on the HR person you talk to, you’ll hear tenure and level grouped into “market”, but market is accounting for both factors relative to geography.

An S3 getting promoted has an additional year at the firm than an S2 getting promoted, so they’re going to be paid more. In my business unit, M1s normally make between $100-$105k, but that’s the average of the band. There’s room below that, and the room below that tends to be occupied by early promotes. The percentage raises tend to be the same.

Basically if you have two high performers who are equal on paper, and one decides to go for an early promotion and the other doesn’t, the early promotion will always be making less than people at their new level, but always be making more than the people they entered with.

It depends on what you want. I personally don’t feel like making $10,000 less for the same amount of work, so I’d never take the early manager promotion. If you prefer more money quicker even if it’s less than you should be getting paid for the job, then early promo might be right for you.

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Audit specifically - I think it doesn’t require a great deal of intelligence so when you see you can make more and actually stimulate your brain..well leaving becomes real tempting and I think that’s when people leave.

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My Experience has been the firms do a bad job of explaining raises and salary bands and what Exp Senior Managers / Directors/ Partners make - I know it is hard bc the firms are somewhat secretive and location matters - that is 200k is not a lot in NYC but is very nice in Boise

People leave who are burnt out that may limit their future potential - a nice bump and better hours seem alluring but the career path might be somewhat limited

And yes there are the ones who choose the right company and hit the ISO or Nonqual lottery but I know plenty of CPAs who were wealthy on paper only to see it crash and burn

If you are undecided and are a high performer talk to your partner about career prospects and salary ranges at different levels and compare future opportunities

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Something no ones saying a lot. I also think people get to PA, see the partners, and don’t really envy them. Sure they make a lot of money, but I don’t come to work everyday hoping one day I can be just like them

likehelpful

Because they get overworked by being put on everyone’s project and do not feel like they can say no (or don’t want to say no)

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That is largely a myth. Many of the people who leave are very good, but not all of them. Most that leave can’t handle the pace or the pressure. Some want families and think rightly or wrongly that Public is not the best place to be.

I was in Public for 40 years. The last 23 at Deloitte and I worked with exceptional people that have high intellects, strong leadership skills and have evolved into great teachers. The mediocre are lucky to hang on, much less rise to the top.

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Are you a partner ? Thought partner are forced retired at age 60

What is considered mediocre performer?

Spending so much time on brain numbing calls feels like a waste of life!

What high performers need are strong boundaries, leverage and good teammates. For example, would partners rather you be on 5 engagements for 6 months and quit, or 3-4 engagements and stay there for years? If they're smart, it's the latter. If you set strong boundaries and make good relationships early on, it will help you not get burnt out. As a senior, I know how many engagements I can be on and performing high quality work. I delegate as much as possible overseas, then as much as possible to my staff, then delegate to myself. If I still have too much on my plate at that point, I ask the manager or partner to directly review some areas the experienced staff worked on while I review the overseas and newer staff's work in addition to mine. I also tried resigning a few years ago, which is when I was honest and discussed a hard stop of how many hours a week I can work. I have a good rep for getting work done really fast and efficiently, so don't get rude comments or anything about the fewer hours. Instead, I think it's decreased turnover since more members on my team are considering being on flex work arrangements or reduced hours instead of quitting. As star wars said, this is the way!!!! (I can't claim to be interesting though 😅 just a suburb mom!)

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