Related Posts
Conversation Starter
Chief
Notice period during 6 months of probation?
Does murex tool has really high demand?
Anonymous User
Additional Posts in Law
Rising Star
Has anyone else been feeling this way?
New to Fishbowl?
Download the Fishbowl app to
unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.
unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.
Are you a woman? This is standard-issue gendered “feedback”. End of the day you just have to be yourself (unless you’re objectively a jerk), and if you’re in a workplace where your style isn’t valued, find a new one. As I get older, I’m becoming much more comfortable with the idea of people finding me a little difficult. Can’t please ‘em all!
When I was a senior associate a male partner told me I needed to be careful to to be too nice because people would take advantage of it and said he had had a similar issue. I’m a man too. Weird to immediately jump to sexism
Let me guess ... You're a girl? Because didn't you hear we are a b-word for doing what men do and seen as weak when we don't?
idk about u, but we love when a smart woman tells us what to do
The key is to define your own version of professional confidence and find mentors who support that.
Sylvia Ann Hewitt wrote and updated a book on Executive Presence and there is a one hour talk she gave that is out there as well if you only have the hour to spare. She talks about this difficult balance especially for women but also provides some tips such as balancing the forcefulness with humor and how to relate the communication to the greater good of the organization or team and not to personal advancement. While it can often still feel like a no win situation, some of the tips may resonate with you. But ultimately I agree with others that you will need to strike that balance that works for you as there are always those who will criticize where you fall on this balance.
This reminds me of a time when I was told, in the same breath, that I both “lack appropriate judgment in my communications” and “am easily intimidated by others” - basically the same message dressed up in fancier language. I’ve also had certain partners tell me that I need to soften my tone. It’s all BS.
Attorney 3 is spot on about the gaslighting in BigLaw. And if the partner brings in enough money, they don't give a rat's ass if the person is too forceful (or "too nice") and gloss over the misery the person exacts on others because money is king. And even if you're not in BigLaw, the pattern is similar in other firms, with some exceptions at the really good firms where they may actually care about their people. As a woman, I have experienced this, too, though more on the "don't be such a school marm" side when I try to get people to do what they're actually supposed to be doing and just aren't. With age, it has declined, since I am supposed to have gravitas and authority, so in your 40s and beyond, it's more OK to do things that people judged you for in your 20s and even 30s, especially for women. There's an ageism thing where younger people aren't supposed to be as forceful unless they are stars bringing in money in the financial world, for example. And especially young women need to be nice, but not pushovers, not too attractive/enticing but not too frumpy, either. It's just a constant Catch-22 that is exhausting and will require more time and energy on your behalf as you constantly try to thread the needle. Not sure that will magically change, maybe it requires another 20 years (though we seem to be slipping backwards, not forwards, in the US in terms of societal progression). But know that with age, that pressure will increasingly decline.
Aging does have some benefits :)
Just be yourself. A lot of that feedback is bullshit. Firms don’t care about that when it’s all said and done or they at least do not prioritize it. The good thing is that you seem to have empathy for others which is something most in big law don’t have. Treat people how you would want to be treated and the rest will take care of itself. Big law has a tendency to gaslight people in order to mask their own false opinions, beliefs and overall agenda which is almost always self serving (you just need to find out what that is). I’ve witnessed firms keep many asswhole partners, tough personalities and socially awkward people around for decades for business reasons or because they have a sponsor protecting them. Not that you should strive to be like that but it just shows where the priorities lie.
Outside of doing all you can on your end, make sure you have a sponsor (which is different than a mentor) who can vouch for you behind closed doors. This will help you take control your narrative.
This holds for outside big law as well. Just noticed this wasn’t the big law bowl lol
You are being gaslighted by someone who subscribes to The 48 Laws of Power. It is being done to you to keep you off balance. You do not have to believe me. Get the audiobook and listen to it for yourself. Then write be back and tell me what you learned. Make a commitment not to become what the book is about - I am encouraging you to listen to the audiobook so that you are aware of what is going on.
sounds like pretenses for them to build a claim to lay u off
Let me guess, you’re a woman.
I would just say, its tricky and it takes time to find your voice and your strength. Watch other women and decide which qualities you do or dont like and only take the “you need to be tougher” like 10% to heart. Being underestimated is totally a super power you can use to your advantage! It can be very disarming in depositions and its all about finding your own voice. Thats a long winded way of saying just keep doing the best you can do, be a spounge and trust that it takes time. Also like every woman has to deal with, consider your anxiety a rite of passage and use it to fuel your drive. You got this!!
Have you tried giving off crouching tiger, hidden dragon vibes? People know I’m nice because I have to be but deep down standing ready to scuffle.
If that doesn’t come to you naturally try adding Evanescence to your playlist at the gym.
I was told by my legal assistant/paralegal that if I was more of a bitch, she would get more work done for me. I was the only woman attorney at our firm. The paralegals had an abundance of work, and because I was ‘too nice’, they prioritized the men and their work. That was ten years ago and I am no longer at that firm, but it stuck with me. It’s hard find the right balance!
Without more (context), it is difficult to give constructive feedback. I do not want to assume, on how "holding the line" or "pushing back" is done, but there are different ways of doing these things that can come across (very much as you identify) AS a function of just who is holding the bar.
That bar will be different not only PER person, but per situation per person. The only advice that I could venture without knowing more is that if you FEEL that you have to guess, then have a discussion with that person and let them know specifically the parameters of why you feel that you are being placed in a 'guess situation.' You may well have it confirmed that you ARE expected to guess, but that in itself can help inform your tactics.