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Hi Fishes,
This is on behalf of a friend .Can someone please put on some light on the below query ?
Company : Morgan Stanley
Designation : Associate - Global
Role : Compliance Technology Strategy
Division : Legal and Compliance
How is this position for a BE+ MBA , total 3+ years of IT experience in top MNC.What would be the expected CTC and next hierarchy designation ( after a promotion ) ? Morgan Stanley
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I’d refer her to HR. Advise FMLA helps protect her job in situations where she needs to take time off of work due to health issues and refer her to contact the HR rep who can assist and go over the process.
Hi- someone with a chronic health condition here, also a manager.
These situations are hard as a manager. I commend you for being reflective and asking how to do right by your employees. And the added stress of a difficult employee situation when you’re already stretched thin sucks.
In case it’s useful, here’s some informal perspective from being on both sides of this equation as both a manager and an employee with a chronic incurable health issue I wouldn’t wish on anyone.
#1 Ask the employee what they need to be successful in the job. People are capable of a lot when they have the right conditions. You don’t need them to and shouldn’t ask them to disclose medical details. but have conversations about what supports they need and provide them.
#2 what would it be like to be open to letting go of your expectations about how things should be? The gap between how you want it to be and reality is often a place of heartache. Another way to look at this, if they’re getting their job done—however it gets done—awesome. Trust me you’ll have one of the most loyal employees ever if you support them in being their best selves in spite of their reality and don’t make a health condition into a source of shame and feeling less than.
#3 Keep them accountable, of course. Shared agreement on goals, documented, can save a lot of headache. Also prevents the feeling from employee perspective that the goal post was randomly shifted.
#4 There absolutely can be situations where the person and the job aren’t going to be a fit. And there are unfortunately some folks who have learned that they can use the excuse of illness as a free pass. But most cases aren’t that. Should you find yourself in the icky land of disciplinary action, your documentation trail relative to those shared goals/expectations is key here.
#5 Recognize this isn’t ideal for the employee either. Don’t underestimate the level of shame that can come with being sick and trying to hold down a job. If this person has a new diagnosis they could also be experiencing a hell of a lot of fear or grief about the delta between how they wanted life to go and how it’s actually going. Stirring up an environment of extra stress—where the employee feels they have a target on their back—does no one any good. And for some health conditions (eg some autoimmune disorders, migraine, and others) situations of high stress can contribute to condition flaring, which begets more performance issues, etc..
#6 work with your HR business partners for guidance specific to your situation.
Best of luck.
Great reply!
Sounds like most people on here don’t understand chronic health conditions. They’re not predictable. You can be fine and then be hit with terrible pain that interferes with your work. You’re not taking extra time to have fun, you’re forced to do it because the pain/problems these conditions cause can be debilitating even if no one can see what’s going on inside your body. Maybe if this person can get accommodations, then everyone can start minding their own business. And maybe work harder to perform at this person’s level since he/she is already doing better than everyone.
From an HR perspective, you need to speak with your HR department. If she qualifies for FMLA or ADA you may need to have your employee have an interactive discussion about accommodations.
Working from home a day or two a week if she is out performing everyone else is not a lot to ask for many positions. Unless it is a position she cannot do from home due to the essential duties of the job, I believe these days we need to be more accommodating. Businesses are losing out on great talent due to being inflexible. No one wants to be babysat and micromanaged. Employees do not need to be watched to get the work done. At my organization we have championed making work life more flexible and our talent pool, productivity, and culture has improved greatly.
Have to say, it's nice to actually hear this perspective from HR.
Someone at my prior company did this and since she was outperforming her peers and had a chronic health issue. They trusted her enough and her health condition to turn her role into remote work 👩💻 only. She only would take her personal time off after that. Remote work 👩💻 can also be at the companies discretion. Hopefully she isn’t interviewing for remote work. Retaining good talent is an investment.
If the work required in office, this employee would be performing poorly right now. They are quite literally proving this very assumption wrong.
This will depend on a few different factors. A chronic medical condition may qualify as an ADA accommodation which would allow her to do her job in a slightly different way, or at different times. FMLA for an intermittent leave may also be needed if she can’t work at all. I highly recommend that you get with your HR team.
FMLA can be used for a block of time or intermittent time.
Good morning. While you understand that this person has health issues, this is STILL a business. Their absence can put a strain on the workload and the rest of the team. This employee should consider taking a little time off to get affairs in order. Question: with the health issues, it the work suffering, deadlines not met, etc?
How much of this is about them needing accommodations vs you wanting control of their coming and goings?
If they out perform their peers the question we should be asking is why someone that needs wellness accommodations is able to outperform people that don’t. Chronic illness is just that, chronic, it can’t be “cured” only managed.
If they are asking for support in managing their health while also meeting their work obligations I don’t see an issue.
You mentioned wanting to be equitable, if they are meeting and exceeding their work obligations and require an accommodation m, for any reason, a team culture where equity is the norm should not be negatively impacted by that.
If there are rumblings within your team maybe instead of trying to no longer accommodate a top performer, this is an opportunity to talk to your team about compassion and “time watchers”.
You could have a conversation with the manager to change their hours to start later if needed to see if that could help and just remind them of FMLA and how it works and maybe that will help out.
I thought a good company was suppose to accommodate you as long as it does not interfere with your performance. Saying it’s “not fair” to the rest of the teams is odd given nobody wants to be sick.
Yeah some people only care about the popularity contest though.
If you are aware that she may need FMLA, you need to go to HR for advice. You can't force her to complete the forms, but your company may need to document that it made her aware of FMLA. It also ensures that she only uses the protected amount of time.
Best advice
I typically base decision on if he/she is able to meet job expectations. If able to do job, and well with accommodations, then not an issue. However if work is not getting done, team picks up slack then HR is where I go.
I would adopt an attitude: as soon as the job well done, I don't care where you are and how much you work.
We r not in kindergarten to control people. At this level they can organised themselves.
Unless you work on a fabric
👏👏👏👏
I recommend addressing your ableism bias. There are many resources to educate you so you can become a more inclusive leader. For those recommending FMLA, remember you do not get paid while on FMLA. For someone with a chronic illness, the expenses that come with medical bills not covered my insurance can be a huge burden. So many will do all they can to avoid FMLA. Since this individual is a top performer, where is the flexibility and accommodations? ADA laws require organizations to make reasonable accommodations for employees with a disability. Not all disabilities are visible. Most are people with chronic illnesses. As a leader, work with HR to identify accommodations so your employee knows they are at an organization that cares not just about their performance but their wellbeing.
Love this! This person is already dealing with extra challenges and still doing a great job. Those team members need to focus on themselves and not make this person feel even more excluded.
I have an associate that sounds just like this. If it is a chronic condition, maybe try doing a touch base with her to see how she is doing, how her workload is and if she is feeling overwhelmed. Then mention that you understand her situation and then suggest or mention that the company has FMLA that could help her instead of just using PTO.
I’ve used this approach with my associate, while she still has not signed up for it, she felt seen and appreciated my concern.
Coming from someone who has a chronically ill child, and found myself in this exact position. It's all about where you work, if her job duties are not being met then, by all means, offer the benefits of FMLA, otherwise let her work. There is nothing worse than being micromanaged or nagged when there is nothing to even bring up. My employer has accommodated my work-life balance and I am exceedingly growing in my field. The last thing a sick person needs to feel insecure about is her job, which most likely is her source of medical benefits and sustainable income. Understandably known, being sick is scary on its own, just be there. Put family values before your own and you'll thrive.
Has health issues AND over performer. Sounds like you could use a reality check, some empathy, and leadership training.
Interesting that HR has done nothing with this, but I have come to the general conclusion that there are a ton of HR folks out there that are not trained. The problem with “chronic” health conditions is that they can fall into this FMLA/ADA vortex…and you may have to accommodate them both ways (but that doesn’t mean a company should be forced to push a large additional workload onto someone else for an extraordinary amount of time. It comes down to a few things. Is it an extraordinary burden on the business or creating an additional job to do so? Sounds possible…I am not privy to the whole situation. Here’s the thing: if Covid proved anything to us, it’s that about 50% of the jobs in America’s office space CAN be done from home, we just done WANT them to be.
Here's my story regarding a similar situation;
I was hired by a company in a managerial position. My store manager gave me the "low down" on all employees, how they act, respond and work.
One particular employee was having severe tardy issues. Being a new manager, I explained that everything happening from that day forward was new to me. Meaning any past issues were cleaned from the slate, I wanted my employees to understand that I was here to help move forward and assist them in all areas, whether it be professional or personal. I sat down with each employee and introduced myself, explained my personality and thanked them for welcoming me. I explained how I was hired to help and I would do the best of my ability to do so.
The employee my store manager was concerned about explained he had personal things that were clashing with his work schedule. I created a new schedule to accommodate his family life. For my first month that particular employee was late a total of three times, all three times he called an hour or earlier to let me know. I found out one day he suffers from Chrohn's disease, which explains why he had issues getting to work on time.
It's important to sit down with your employees and speak to them on a personal level. We are all human, we all make mistakes and some of us are not at the stage of life where we can separate personal and work. Understand that each employee has the opportunity to grow. Each company has the opportunity to grow. You can shape your employees to your company BUT you must ALSO shape your company TO your employees.
I'd sit down with your employee and try to work something out that will benefit them and the company. Go a step forward and do this will ALL of your employees
Im reading so many insensitive responses here. All I will say is be the manager you would like to have. I personally don’t care how many time they are absent as long as the milestone and deliverables are clear and on time. If it affects that then I simply ask we rearrange to accommodate . And suggest if we need a redistribution of workload. Anything other than that is your personal perception based on the misconception that productivity is tied to being in an office… it is not . And if the current working capacity is not a fit for that person then. I help them find one that is, within my team. There is always a way to accommodate if you approach it with honesty and openness and the understanding that person is struggling with desease. Not matter what kind.
Is there a reasonable accommodation you can make to shifting her schedule or where she works on an ongoing basis (even short term) while she needs it? Is she still able to complete her work with an accommodation? It could remove a lot of stress for all to have a plan that allows her to take care of herself and be able to focus on work.