{ "media_type": "text", "post_content": "What salary range would you describe as middle class.\n\nLCOL I considered my family middle class when my dad made 50k in the 90s. Life seemed alright.\n\n25 years later my dad and I both are at around 170, but I still consider us middle class like we were in the 90s, but now it feels like more of a struggle", "post_id": "61af894f7adb9900366eac74", "reply_count": 300, "vote_count": 27, "bowl_id": "552d1d24dc1c586b09d2d051", "bowl_name": "Consulting", "feed_type": "crowd" }

What salary range would you describe as middle class. LCOL I considered my family middle class when my dad made 50k in the 90s. Life seemed alright. 25 years later my dad and I both are at around 170, but I still consider us middle class like we were in the 90s, but now it feels like more of a struggle

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There’s a psychological bias towards the middle class, basically everyone in the middle 98% believe they are middle class, and that has to do with the people around us that we self select into (the wealthier you are the more you will have wealthy friends) and also has to do with our need to fit in. That effects even political affiliations, because no one will support taxing the “middle class” while upper class urbanites gladly support “taxing the rich” when they are themselves the target (the very rich don’t pay much in income tax anyway). So it’s natural that you “feel” middle class, but the data doesn’t lie, and a 250k HHI is not “middle”

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OW1 If you don’t classify via income then you are merely comparing subjective, anecdotal data points like the people you know. No one is upper class if you compare yourself to Bezos or to families with generational wealth as the benchmark. Once you make millions of dollars in your lifetime you can ALWAYS continue to compare yourself to next person/family who is wealthier than you which is why it os a poor measure of class/status

I dunno. I think the metric of gross or net HHI doesn’t adequately capture the nuances of personal finance circumstances (loans, debt, multiple jobs etc). I think if you can cover housing costs (either rent or mortgage) with one secure source of income, you’re middle class. Probably middle class if you can pay student loan. Definitely middle class if you’re putting money aside for retirement/other savings. Come to think of it, I’d stratify it as: - Welfare Class (people reliant on public assistance to get by) - Labor Class (the vast majority of people, people whose main source of income is labor) - The New Middle Class (people like us on this app who rely on labor-earned income but have 401ks, 529s etc for rainy days and retirement) - Investor Class (people who mostly rely on investments)

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Clearly many people define class level relative to their personal situation and not some objective definition.

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Interesting question. $100-$300K in LCOL and $100k - 500k in MCOL in my opinion.

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This is the NYC definition of middle income - over 100k for one person.

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With a few exceptions, everyone on this app is roughly upper middle class or on the way to it.

likesmart

Anything below 500k is poverty

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🎶money can’t buy you class🎶 clearly after reading some of these comments 🤦🏽‍♀️

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Girl…

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If you are struggling to enjoy your life at 170K , i am sure you are going to be struggling at 570K as well! I know I made a lot of assumptions here, but I think once the basic needs are met; income and happiness don’t have a proportional relationship anymore.

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If as most people are saying here middle class is between 100 - 300K. That means the percentage of people below the middle class has increased significantly in the past few years and likely continue. that’s is scary

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I have moved from the federal poverty line to the 2% over the past 20 years. The habits that kept me fed and housed at my smallest salary are the same habits I have today.

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Bravo P4. Incredible story, and congrats!

The issue is that “class” is defined by income alone and not debt. Income wise my wife and I are well off making a combined $550k but you throw in med school loans, business school loans, mortgage, car payments, all sorts of insurance, HOA, etc and we’re def middle class at the end of the day. Yes, we feel we have the means to purchase most things we desire but our bank accounts aren’t reflective of our income

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M3, I wouldn’t include children in the calculation since they aren’t of working age and are still dependents. I think it even makes sense to exclude anyone that’s not working full time (Debatable depending on the situation). It doesn’t make sense to include kids in college working part time or those still entirely dependent on their parents. You could still bucket them into a class after the fact but it’s a function of their parents.

Most people consider themselves middle class unless they are really poor (on govt programs) or very wealthy > $1M income, >$1M home, and or dont have to work ever again (have enough assets) . This question is so subjective based on how old you are, where you live, how big is your family, and what are your liabilities (aging family, school loans, healthcare needs). When I broke $100k in my late 20s and single, after college standards of living and financial childhood struggles, I felt upperclass. Having a family income more than 2x in my late 30s with 3 children I feel more middle class while the reality is I’m in the top 1% of the global population.

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Don’t bring NYC and SF into this mix. In a average sized city like Columbus Ohio which is representative of most nice, livable cities in the US, middle class would be $85k for a young family of 4.

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Yea in 1979 maybe

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People understand class via relative wealth. If you want to feel rich, get poorer neighbors

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And my point is that income is almost completely irrelevant in determining whether someone is upper class. It’s all about wealth, and how you can live your life given your wealth. People with very high income but early in their career could be considered upper class using the trash definition, but since they can’t yet live the high life, they aren’t yet.

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M3, you’ve been all over the map on this one. You’ve said it relates to spending. Then you said it has to do with one’s perception of themselves. Is this one hour final answer?

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The responses on this thread are disturbing. Thanks Instagram! 🤦🏻‍♂️

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I think it depends where you live. In my hometown, $50k was enough for a middle class lifestyle but I live in a major city now where $50k is considered broke

The top 1% are considered as the 1.3M households who gross over $500K annual; not that I agree with that evaluation based on data. I would guess the middle (lower to upper middle) is households who gross $150-500K. Variables in there of course (like cost of living). That means I grew up lower, and currently am only middle; possibly always will be. Yay!

175-260k TC

I think most 🐠 here have a skewed perception of what middle class entails. To give you some reference, the family from Malcolm in the Middle would be considered middle class. On the lower end though.

Of course they would be middle class. Who was suggesting otherwise?

To feel rich you need to escape the world of earning a W2. Everyone I know that is rich rich doesn’t have a normal taxable income. It’s all financial assets and real estate.

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