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Additional Posts in The Safe Zone (for All) to talk Race
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{waspm}I previously took it as a threat to my job prospects. That said... If done thoughtfully it is necessary given the poor D&I performance of most workplaces, particarly in senior roles. I worked for a company that had a white male filling every single VP and above position. I was super embarrassed and ashamed because I wasn't really sure if my own accomplishments were a result of merit or because hiring managers and executives "saw themselves" in me. Racism cuts both ways (unequally, but white people don't often see their own pain from it like lost friendships, cultural experiences, etc)
1) Allowing diversity quotas to impact the hiring process.
2) Really don’t support it, but understand why some do.
C1 - is the persons race has impacted all other factors of their lives including education, job opportunities, resume screenings, etc. - why should we exclude it in recruiting/hiring?
It’s hypocritical to not fight against these injustices and cry about the perceived/real or not unfairness of goals/quotas (however you want to classify them).
And if you’re against those former listed injustices then how can you be against companies trying to do a very small part to level the playing field when those far more significant ills have not been addressed in a meaningful way. Because let’s be honest, if they had been addressed, would there be a need for AA?
Bowl Leader
Moderator NOTE:
loving the convo and insights on affirmative action in hiring vs not so far.
Also want to take the opportunity to invite those who are reading but oppose affirmative action
Your voice is also welcome here.
OP I appreciate what you seem to be trying to do.
1. My understanding of affirmative action is what was originally signed by Kennedy and then Johnson where hiring can’t be based on discrimination on basis of race, sex, etc.
Other applications would require quotas such as college admissions.
2. My company has diversity programs with the stated aim to achieve this.
3. Difficult question as company is incredibly diverse which can bring about different challenges and issues I haven’t previously seen as much from an American lens. I regularly see issues and animosity from other cultures occur ( ex: Between Indian and Pakistani employees).
I don’t think company policy can address or fully govern against societal issues and human characteristics.
They are making a good faith effort though. There is no silver bullet or policy that can address all of the racism and societal debt that has piled up over the years, but it can help make things better.
Universities and quotas was what I was referring to and historical applications.
Fair call on precision
Love it.
Bowl Leader
Moderator Question:
1. Can as many people as possible share if they have learned anything new from this thread on affirmative action
New learning can be:
- a fact you did not know
- new insight into how someone else thinks or what some else believes
- new insight about how to think about or discuss this issue
2. So what?
It’s also fine to say “I’ve learned nothing”
Note: many assume that the goal of this bowl is to convince others of your opinion. It’s not. It’s to understand others and to let them understand you.
A perfectly ok outcome is “I FULLY understand you, and I think you’re wrong” the most important part of that statement is “I fully understand you”
In some cases you will achieve changing someone’s mind. That’s not a realistic goal in 90% of cases. But broadening their understanding of your position and fully understanding theirs. Is realistic in every case.