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TBWA NY layoffs today.
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I was in the final stages of an interview with Microsoft two weeks ago, in partner marketing. Then the recruiter told me they were putting the hiring process on hold to assess the need for the role. Well, then we heard about Microsoft layoffs last week. Seems like most were in Xbox and Project Alpha but there’s not a lot of information out there. Should I hold out any hope that I’m going to get this job? Any insights on how much these layoffs have impacted the marketing org and/or new hiring?
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From friends that I have there, it’s a lot less public but it’s happening. Whereas BCG and MCK it’s very well known across colleagues what’s actually going on.
The way I look at it is that Bain has a bit more of a conservative mindset when it comes to hiring and PIPs - we’re not quite as aggressive at hiring during booms and not quite as aggressively trimming our teams now. Of course the rate of PIPs is going to vary with the amount of business that comes in, but maybe it’s not as spiky as our competitors.
This is not what the data shows on hiring. We pulled the breaks on hiring way later than MB in the covid boom so our problem is actually worse (at least in Europe)
Half my MBA new hire class was let go before the first year due to “performance” - and most of them at the 6 month mark. You tell me
Yeah nah C1
I am a PIP survivor; currently thriving at Bain. Just saying.
From a Bain friend: “we’re not at your level (of 🪓) yet, but i feel it coming”
I’m assuming they’ll just set a very high bar for promotion instead of axing people at 1y.
FE rated M. Can confirm what B6 is saying is accurate.
Coach
It feels like yes we have more PIPs than the last few years, but prob back to pre-Covid norms (but no one on here knows for sure).
But it also feels like we’re doing less than McK and BCG, and that is probably why the Glassdoor scores diverged so much.
Coach
Not in my experience (and I joined in 2011). I’d say long term average was 10-15% (but remember you don’t always know why someone is leaving - and I think people are more attuned to the why on the current environment). Also, I have not seen any data to support 20-30% exits right now. But perhaps your office is different.
100%. The bar has been raised significantly for promotions. Bain is also much smaller than BCG and McKinsey so you’re just not going to hear about it as much
My guess is that this is all perception. I think all three are doing more or less the same thing to a similar degree, you just hear more or less about it due to reasons.
E.g., Bain hires more undergrads so they’re a bit more in the cult, less likely to say bad things about getting cut. They’re also cheaper and so less likely to get cut. Combined with firm size you have a way smaller cohort of MBA+ / post MBA roles running around to complain on fishbowl or raise a fuss about getting unfairly axed.
All the firms have the same messaging, none of them appear to be seeing vastly different performance. It’s mostly perception. You’re at similar risk at all three.
Coach
Probably true for Consulting staff. For support functions I think we fought harder to keep ours: only ~40 let go as part of a shakeup on what that particular function focuses on.
My understanding is both MB have fired 1000s of non consulting staff?
It all depends on what you call typical.
Either way, what seems to be agreed upon is that the performance bar shifts to optimize Bain's economics. PIPs are higher in bad times and lower in boom times. How we brand that ("layoffs" vs "reversion to normality") is just semantics. The principle is the same either way: they are a for profit company that will take actions to protect its bottom line.
I personally still think Bain is a great place to work, but it would be a lie to pretend the performance evaluation process is perfect or fair.
The bar is definitely much higher at the moment. As someone who writes the reviews for the team and has been with bain ~10yrs, this is the most pushback I’ve ever received from HR and partners on reviews (and all pushing down). I was told by a senior partner we are targeting 30% pip.
A bit more, but nowhere near what it sounds like at BCG. It’s more going to be felt at the more typical up or out points (i.e. promos) vs pushing out lots of people mid grade. Some people call that raising the bar, my view is it is just a natural consequence of fewer data points to prove cases for promotions.
last year’s spring CDC was a bloodbath, and not just for people up for promotion. i know newly-promoted PL1s get the boot
Depends who you ask. I think yes as well as many others. They recently admitted to making an internal team redundant after rumours had been circulating for months.
Bain started vol. redundancy in London for some grades
Is it just higher standard to perform out the gate and less tolerance for slower start? You guys tell me, is it performance or will there always be cuts "Jack Welch" style?
I'd say yes more than "normal", but we also got used to a crazy period in 2021/22. Remember, even though they're firing they also do have to keep hiring.
Never said it did. But it is life and much better than in most periods in history and in most countries