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This is so true for some in-house positions - especially tech. I would verbalize your limitations and push off work that is not a priority. Leadership needs to fix the problem. What company?
Working on it. Not sure how it’s going to pan out. I’d rather not out the company at this point since we don’t have a big legal team.
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Big law hours require big law dollars. Push back and establish realistic expectations based on a more normal 40 hour week. If you need support staff to accomplish this, absolutely let management know.
Don't jump back to big law. Most in-house positions are not like this.
I have been in-house for 14 months now for an extremely rapidly growing company and have had the same experience. I’m consistently over worked, and it hasn’t slowed down once. I feel like at least at a firm you get the benefit of a billable hour bonus.
No real advice here, just wanted to say I feel your pain, and it’s beyond frustrating.
Mid size public company here and this is absolutely true. Next to no support staff. However, I still generally don't work more than 40-45 hours a week. If they don't provide support staff, it just means I can get less substantive legal stuff done...
It depends on what you want. Some people have the entrepreneurial bent, some don’t. I left big law for real estate private equity, but I’m also a principal. From your post, OP, it seems as if you’re perhaps not getting the upside if your company makes it. If you’re just a salaried in-house counsel with no equity then you’re not crazy to go back to law firm life. But if you believe in the company and have a stake in it, then you might be just be annoyed—which every lawyer is at some point.
Well that is a calculation only you can make with respect to how you feel about the company. Will it pay off? We always hear about the guy who sold his stake in Apple for $800. But we never hear about those who wasted time at a startup with nothing to show for it. Only you can make that assessment.
While all in house experiences are not like this, most are. I started my career in house and decided to go into big law for this reason.
I warn associates about this “in house is better WLB” everyday. Sure, there are some in house jobs that are a legit 40 hrs but they are not as plentiful as people think. People in those jobs aren’t leaving especially if the pay is solid. I’ve also found there to be a little less flexibility for most in house gigs. They expect you in the seat and visible. Little things like Dr.Appointment sometimes require actually taking pto hours. Big law is much more flexible in this respect. No one cares where you are or when you do it for the most part just get the work done and be responsive. All that to say, just know what you want and really understand what you are getting into. All in house jobs are not the same. #grassisntalwaysgreener
D1 - fair, but I would say your experience is not the norm for in house. Do you think being a director makes a difference? That’s another thing also depends on what level you come in at some of these places. Really interested because ppl need to know how to identify these kind of opps to avoid OP’s position.
I think you have one of the coveted in house jobs I was referring to. Not sure how many in house folks are giving 5 business day lead times with no push back. This is probably because your company actually values legal, which is awesome.
This is not an uncommon situation in-house but there are definitely ways to set boundaries and manage this. Work on establishing some internal processes to triage intake of new requests, and require the business to set priorities as to where you allocate your time. Explore whether the business has some headcount that can cover some of the admin tasks you are currently doing- demonstrate that it is in their best interest to free up some of your time for higher value add work. Work on some templates and ways to streamline common contracts. Work on policies that say certain deals do not need legal review. Work on relationships with outside counsel to funnel overflow work as needed.
More personally, protect your calendar and set time blocks where internal clients can’t plug meetings. Be firm about your schedule and being unavailable during certain hours. Ask yourself whether you are giving your internal clients GOOD turnaround, or EXCELLENT turnaround. Maybe you are going above and beyond to be responsive, and can train your clients to accept longer lead times.
It sounds like the business is scaling quickly and there will be some growing pains to work through as you iron out processes and expectations with your clients as the business grows.
I “clock in/clock out” when I want as no one is monitoring my hours (tech company). Some days I work 10-14 hours if I’m trying to move a bunch of deals off my plate, other days I work 3-4 hours and then decide nothing is urgent and spend the rest of the day with the family. It all balances out to a normal 9-5 with the freedom to shift my hours around as needed (provided the work always gets done).
That said, I’m prob 25-30% underpaid for my title, and 100-125% underpaid considering we had two critical roles in legal and privacy leave and I’ve been picking up the slack for 6 months while the company looks for replacements.
Since a significant raise is unlikely later this year after reviews, I’ll likely move on to another in-house role.
FWIW, I truly enjoy the work and have not dreaded going to work a single day since going in house. Outside of court days, I dreaded every day as a litigator.
If your role is anything like mine, the one unexpected annoyance is the never ending long term projects. I did not anticipate being saddled with so many things they take months to complete, which means there is always something kind of hanging over my head. I don’t let that interfere with WLB, but part of me thought going in house would legit mean there were times I would simply have nothing to do until the next contract needed to be negotiated. Perhaps that was naïve.
Rising Star
This sounds pretty normal to me. I'm in SV, have been in house as the sole or junior corporate attorney. Worked insane hours and burned out. Was exhausted. It's hard to delegate when there isn't anyone to delegate to. Same for coverage.
I will say that working with sl leaders to push back on some requests helps, as can using outside counsel more.
This has not been my experience but I was warned that it could happen, especially if you’re the most junior person. To the extent you can, stop doing admin tasks for other people, stop organizing events, etc. basically do what your job is and that’s it. Once people get accustomed to your extra labor they will resent you for setting boundaries.
I’m in the same boat. Legal dept of 1 and given a law library card.
But I was a public defender for 10+ years so I’m used to not having any resources.
Not my experience.
Is there still the expectation that you will work after hours to get things done? Or is it more like do as much as you can within certain more reasonable hours
No real hours expectation, but emails will be sent at weird hours and sometimes responses are expected then.
This hasn’t been my experience but this sounds awful. I’m sorry OP!
Did you know that before you accepted?
Seems quite common for a more nascent company (like a late stage start up/new public company).
You have to advocate for your department.
Rising Star
Only works if you can prioritize and people understand you’ll get to their work when you get to it. If management doesn’t understand that, then it’s not sustainable.
Haha …paralegals
What’s your YOE and salary? If you’re working the same number of yours, you might want to go back to the dark side.
~5 YOE. Market seems fairly slow for corporate now, so if I went back to biglaw, maybe I would be able to have a ~3-6 month ease-in period before it’s crazy again. Who knows.