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From associate to VP - what specially to learn
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It's completely up or out... BBs would keep you around if you're a work horse, but EBs usually would want to see a transition from a with horse (early associate years) to a race horse, i.e. Someone capable of bringing in revenue and moving up to MD on track.
You need to do a bit of self analysis on how you got to where you are right now - all / most of the up and up or did you also somewhat got floated through on a track by not completely sucking
Taking a demotion is probably ok, but moving from MM to EB as an exp VP would be really difficult (too much process focus vs actually thinking strategically and diff client base).
Plus you can always move to another EB if this one doesn't promote you in a year (written or not, it's completely discretionary in an at-will employment)
Good luck!
I'm same year, have gone through the thought process. Depends on where you are in life and how much it would hurt you personally to lose a year. For me I'd rather be somewhere less prestigious but get the responsibility and development now.
For up or out you should have a frank discussion with your target. They shouldn't be hiring for an Associate 3 if there's no VP seat open. Can you extract a guaranteed promotion?
EB better than BB unless you want to bank for life. Do you want to bank for life?
Do you want a life?
I’m really focused solely on the pros/cons of a demotion. Question is trickier than “bb or eb.” what happens if you get demoted but don’t get promoted back? Isn’t it up or out?
I’m a vp. Chill. Exactly it is up or out but why would you make the move without a guarantee? If you did any google you would know that you wouldn’t make the move without a guarantee as3 to vp1. Especially at EB where the assessment to become a VP is much harder
I would assume you’ll get promoted back up unless you are questioning your own performance. Comp-wise, probably a good decision because EBs pay more than MM banks as you move up. So the year back will be made up for within a couple years. The big question is can you stomach an extra year as associate? I made the same switch a few years ago (didn’t have to go back a year) and I certainly was not willing to do an extra year of associate at the time.
I have no doubt about my capacity to do the work and now seems like my last real chance to upgrade in terms of platform/comp.
But I’ve also seen things go wrong for very capable people because of personality fit or poor group placement. I’d have to prove myself all over again in a span of months. However unlikely, the costs of fucking it up are quite high.
Also, tbh, having to take orders from VPs again would be awful for my ego
I’ve learned that a story/explanation goes a long way. If it’s a logical process to you, then taking the demotion isn’t an issue. I had a friend in asset management who was a partner at his firm after nearly 5 years (small joint, couple billion in institutional) move to banking after an MBA and is currently a VP working his way back up. He just got an offer to leave his BB firm to enter as VP at a company in his coverage universe. He’s stroking it. Generally people don’t care as much as you think they do.
Yeah, he realized he wasn’t passionate about following markets everyday and wanted to start over as an operator at a company. He went into banking post MBA in order to make that jump.
VP is the hardest role to find. You have leverage so IDK why you'd take a demotion.
Wait a year and take the hit then. Hard to do VP to Associate. I have rarely seen it in my 13 years. Where it has happened it did not work out. I took hit from VP2 to 1 6 years back which still hurts...