How to best hedge my portfolio using puts?

I basically want insurance on my overall portfolio. Ideally, would like an “explosive” pay-out if markets drop ~15%+. Would want the insurance to work for relatively sudden drops (e.g. March 2020) but also for more drawn out bear markets like 2022.

I was wondering what combination of strike prices and expiration dates would best meet my goal? I was thinking of buying 400 strike puts on SPY for 6 months out.

like
Posting as :
works at
You are currently posting as works at

^2024 doomsday-er…

What’s your macroeconomic thesis for that possibility?

like

10% of my portfolio is triple levered S&P500 ETFs and a large chunk of the rest is in SPY…so no I’m not a doomsday-er. I have zero thesis, I’m just hedging against the possibility. I think of it like buying insurance on your house burning down even if you don’t expect it to happen. But in case markets do drop, the levered ETF will drop 50%+ and it would be nice to have a source of cash to buy more.

like

Unless you’re trading on margin, you don’t need to hedge with this portfolio. The cost of hedging will likely just be a drag on your returns.

like

If you actually have to manage cash flow or liquidity then hedging might make sense. This shouldn’t be an issue for the vast majorly of individuals, but if you’re using margin or leverage maybe there’s a place for it. People who short volatility should certainly think about it.

Hedging tail risk is hard and hasn’t worked well at all the last three years. If you’re mostly passive then just buy and hold and adjust position sizes to match your risk tolerance.

like

I would buy puts that are 10%+ out of the money on SPY or QQQ with an expiration date of 3 months out. QQQ would work better if your portfolio is tech heavy (in which case you could even do 15%+ out of the money puts as QQQ has a higher beta), otherwise SPY is just fine. If you have a larger portfolio, buying puts on SPX or NDX is better than buying puts on SPY or QQQ, respectively, as they are cash settled options and have a lower tax rate for short term gains. Once they expire you can repeat this strategy if you want to continue holding insurance. Expiration dates longer than 3 months out are going to be much more expensive and given bear markets typically drop in waves I would stick to quarterly expirations.

You could also look into buying call options on the VIX.

helpful

Yes, you can roll with 1 month left (assuming you still want the insurance). And agree with Tax Manager on UVXY. I would not use UVXY to hedge. Personally, I would just stick to puts on the large etfs. If the VIX index spikes your out of the money puts will spike in value as well.

like

Puts can be terribly expensive and getting the timing right is tough. I’ve regretted almost every option I have bought that didn’t show huge unusual activity in those options before buying (i.e. someone knows something). I would do one of two things: sell covered calls to offset the cost of the puts. Limiting upside but you won’t lose a ton if the puts expire worthless.

The other option is to short companies that are sure to suffer in a recession. Like heavily indebted companies with maturities coming up soon that they can’t pay off without refinancing the debt. In a liquidity crunch they will not be able to find financing and might go under.

like

Yes this is true in certain scenarios. However, IVP on SPY is 14%

like

What’s your cumulative delta on your portfolio? I’d probably look into leap puts to give you some time

Very few corrections last more than 6 months, so you would want to sell your puts on an upturn if the market drops.

If your portfolio drops 1.2X the market that is your Beta weight.

The IV will rise significantly if the market drops rapidly, and more for mid term than long term. But skew also increases which many option traders ignore to their detriment.

If you don't have a macro reason for a major drop, than buying naked puts is money badly spent.

If you just have a general uneasiness, then buy a put calendar roughly 3% below ATM. You roll the short every week. This will make a very small amount of money and protect you for a drop of about 5%. If the market continues to drop just stop selling the short and let the long run.

like

Buying a put will be an insurance policy that acts as a stop loss. If you exercise the option, your payout will be the strike price minus the original contract price. The value of the put will increase as the stock price decreases. You could sell the put before it expires and net the difference in price. This strategy requires timinig the market. Without inside info (illegal to act on) it is very hard to perfectly time the market. The best most people can do is capture some part of a decline but not the absolute bottom.

On the flip side there are people ready to sell you insurance policies. These people selling to open are betting that things either won't get as bad as people think or that the security will make a comeback in the long run.

First off, what is your experience with options?

I traded the wheel strategy a bit in 2021 so understand some basics like theta decay etc but not much beyond that

Lookup “black swan hedge”. You would need to do something like a put ratio backspread which would “insure” your portfolio by increasing in value if the market drops double digits like in a recession.

Related Posts

Are remittances / gift sent from US to India (from post tax money) considered for any tax breaks or deductibles in the US?

likefunny

Why do firms not use vested stock options as incentive in earlier stages of career?

like

Does anyone know if the 10% penalty and if taxes are waived on a death of a beneficiary? A friend of mine’s 17 year old pass away. I was wondering due to the circumstance, is there any way he can get around paying extra money by doing a 1035 exchange, rollover, withdrawal. Anything out there? Suggestion are welcome.

Hi folks - anyone here is a realtor or was a realtor in Toronto before? Looking to chat with people who have the experience.

like

Where does one apply for commercial RE loans? Looking for co names

like

What is your favorite part about being a realtor?

like

Got offered a pharma/healthcare role (currently work consumer side). 15% more than current role, lateral move, remote for now of course. Not sure if I should take the offer or not, given I have no experience in pharma & health. I said I would sleep on it. Advice?

like

What do you guys think about Investing in palantir which IPOs tomm?

like

What would be a reasonable cost of renting for a single expat dude in Singapore living in decent area ? Would sgd 4K suffice ?

like

Need a working flatmate
Spacious 2bhk in Springfield society, Kharadi.
(Opposite to Reliance mart, less than 2km from WTC)
Brokerage 25k
Monthly rent 25.5k
Security deposit 50k
All above expenses to be divided by 2.

like

Just received a verbal offer from Deloitte Healthcare Ops and Transformation. The salary would be a big bump, technically taking a demotion from SC -> C

I know they laid off people a while back and are now hiring again. Should I be worried about job security at all?

What’s D’s work/life balance like? Appreciate any insight

like

Hi all! Would any of you place a bet with a NFT you own, with the possibility of winning another NFT or walk away with nothing?

Left KPMG last year and still haven’t received my W-2 form yet. Does anyone know where to get this info?

like

Can my current lender refuse to accept the payment from refinance lender because they want to make more money from me? How do I sue them ?

likefunny

Brand new to investing! Husband and I are 37, don’t have any investments other than the home we currently own. Sitting on atleast 100g worth of cash....

like

If anyone is interested in a referral code for a Chase Sapphire Preferred card go ahead and comment so I can dm the link.

Great card for travel, points come fast and great perks for travel.

Hoping to help anyone!

likehelpful

Do you buy insurance when travelling to US for fun? Moved to Europe recently and this will be my first time back in US without employer health insurance - should I buy travel insurance? Where from? Thanks!

like

Anyone use financial planners or wealth managers? Pros / cons / considerations / recommendation for one in NYC?

like

I have an idea for an investment-type thing but am trying to figure out what price point would be attractive to your “everyday” affluent but not 1%er family (I’m talking the 3%ers like myself). If you fit that demographic and were offered a solid investment opportunity with a guaranteed annual yield of 8% and an appreciation of the underlying asset of at 3%, how much would you be willing to invest in it without stressing too much? 10k? 25k? To be clear, not seeking investors here.

like

What is with people not knowing how to read signs? We have a huge one that says “NO CASH ALLOWED” and I still get asked almost everyday if we take cash

like

More Posts

Hi All,

I am having an offer with hcl and Mindtree and some small company, all are given the same package.
Can you please suggest to me which one is better for job security and learning new things.
Yoe :9
Skill: MSBI.
@MINDTREE @HCL

Thanks.

Has anyone here gone through a marriage based green card process with Deloitte? I believe I read somewhere that you can start that process regardless of being in an application period or not. Want to hear some stories of length, initiation, etc

Are tool evaluation (vendors, market analysis etc) projects interesting?

Does ibm give any Diwali gifts?

What the hell happened at Arnold today?

likehelpfulfunny
like

Do your executives and ownership teams care about culture? Do they care about innovating?

My top executive is very “stuck in their ways” and refuses to accept that he is creating disconnects with his team.

like

Can someone please refer me to Deloitte usi for SAP profile?

like

Honest question here-hw do I work better with Indians who come over frm India(on-site) to client?My patience with them is at an all time low since they jst dnt gt the methodology & hate owning anythng

Does Amex renegotiate offer based on counter offer after accepting the offer letter?
My joining is in Aug 1st week.

like

Joining a big(ish)law litigation/investigations practice group in a few weeks. Only biglaw friends I have do transactional so I see what their schedules are like but not sure how lit compares.

Anybody have any insight into how lit is different? Is it more predictable/regular? Less? What do you think the major differences (beyond substance obviously) are between the two?

like
like

Hello everyone. I don’t have a DM feature active, please like this picture (I personally took) to help me get it active. Thanks!

Post Photo
like
like

I want to build my career in analytics. I have offer from EY India, EXL and LatentView Analytics.
EY is more on the side of project management and process improvement in SaaS, as told. While there is hands-on in other two.

If I don't consider pay, which company is the best to go for considering work and culture(peope friendly).

YoE: 5
Tech Stack: SQL, Python, Tableau, PowerBI

like

Type of work in Deloitte ops transformation in health care. Is it just tech?

likehelpful

I feel like my boss never joins my working call with my stakeholders, is this normal in big tech, like they don't have time to sit in the same meeting with you to understand and course correct your working styles? Like I am supposed to take the whole lead from day 1 independently.

like

Had a serious debate with a hipster last night. Was there anyway for America to get all of the idealistic benefits of Bernie Sanders without losing half my paycheck? Solve that and i'll feel the bern

like

Hey! I'm a current CMA who has decided that medicine is not for me after a year of working in the field out of undergrad. What are the first steps for me to break into this career path (outside of the general case prep)? I'm from a T10 undergrad and have research/medical assistant training

like

Additional Posts in Option Traders & Investing

2/25 Thread (General):

likehelpfulfunny

Potential opp on the short side for TSLA?
- X

like

10/06 Thread (BC):

like

3/29 Thread (General):

like

Long time in the making; but we finally sold off from our 50% HWB short. We had two tests at the 3400 level, getting as high as 3420 today before the sell off. Momentum and pessimism over lack of stimulus could take us to the 3107 target quickly, nearly a 10 percent decline over the next month. Stay short my friends. It's going to get bumpy.

Post Photo
like

Sundial Growers 🏄🏻‍♂️🏄🏻‍♂️🏄🏻‍♂️

like

What do you guys think about Investing in palantir which IPOs tomm?

like

@BC what do you think about SHOP puts?

like

3/2 - (specific symbols)

likehelpful

there are two types of fish in this bowl..

Post Photo
like

Best oil stock to buy right now?

like

Hell YEAH!! They JUST approved!!!! Make it rain on Monday!!!

Post Photo
likesmart

Love that in true form I chose the 1 red meme stock. 😂💎💎💎

like

$DPZ 370c 3/27

like

Is blockfi only a bank and not really investing in crypto?

like

Earnings season is here!

Post Photo
like

New to options on fishbowl - I have a call itm with Robinhood that expires tomorrow. If I don’t sell it, what happens? Will they exercise or am I better to sell it?

like

Everyone’s so focused on Airbnb and Doordash lol. Nobody’s talking about C3.ai though 👀

like

anybody watching $SRNE?

like

Thoughts on airline stocks? Good time to get in?

like

New to Fishbowl?

Download the Fishbowl app to
unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.
That was just a preview…
Sign Up to see all discussions
  • Discover what it’s like to work at companies from real professionals
  • Get candid advice from people in your field in a safe space
  • Chat and network with other professionals in your field
Sign up in seconds to unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.

Already a user?
Login here

Share

Embed this post

Copy and paste embed code on your site

Preview

Download the
Fishbowl app

See what’s happening in your industry
from the palm of your hand.

A phone with Fishbowl app

Scan your QR code to download
Fishbowl app on your mobile

Download app

Sign up for free to view this conversation on Fishbowl

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use and Privacy Policy

Already have an account? Log in

Sign up for free to continue using Fishbowl

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use(New) and Privacy Policy(New)
Messaging rates may apply

Already have an account? Log in

For account settings, visit Fishbowl on Desktop Browser or

General

Legal