Related Posts
Hello - hope everyone is having a great weekend. I'm looking into risk assurance opportunities at Meta, especially Application Manager, Controls (min 5 YOE) and Manager, Compliance (min 12 YOE). I am a Senior Manager with 9 years of IT risks assurance experience. Does anyone have any thought on which position I should apply? If anyone currently at Meta could share your experience, that would also help. If anyone is open to providing referrals, I could provide my background. Facebook (Meta)
Hi guys, Now VMware is offering me a 35% percent hike of what I am earning at DellEmc. I just completed one year at DellEmc. Total 2.7YOE But I don't like to go out of Dell, due to some personal commitments I am planning to switch.
Is it a good time to switch?
Can I talk with my manager ?
Are they able to hike the salary of what VMware is offering? Please suggest me.
Dell
More Posts
Has anyone else begun to resent data science?
What’s everyone doing today babes 🧐
Additional Posts in Salary Negotiations
Im not searching for a new job but an acquaintance reached out about a similar role at a similar energy company.Turns out 2 ppl threw my name in the hat. I looked into it and the position was posted 2 weeks ago.Their director wants to meet.I bet pay is one of the first things to be discussed so that no one’s time is wasted.Am I crazy for not wanting to entertain it for less than 20-25% base pay increase?Is it selfish to ask for more? I’m sure most salary conversations end in negotiation anyways?
New to Fishbowl?
unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.
If you ruined your chances, so be it. That just means something better is on the horizon. If they won't share comp, in my experience, then it probably isn't even worth your time or energy.
You didn't do anything wrong by asking. Some recruiters and hiring managers simply choose to be offended over candidates asking for clarity on the only reason they work in the first place. We aren't looking for jobs as a hobby, we are looking for jobs in exchange for money, and we should be able to know without issue what kind of money we are looking at.
Exactly this, I was encouraged to go for an interview with a company who didn't give their salary/benefits package details, got a second interview, the manager I would have been working for was excited to have me come onboard. Then their HR said they couldn't match my salary and benefits expectations and gave the role to someone else. That person lasted 3 months before their old company ",bought," them back. Then HR had the cheek to contact me and told me they'd match what I wanted.. told them no, if I wasn't right and worth it the first time around I didn't want to join them.
You asked a fair question. If the salary is not within the range you are seeking, then why waste your time pursuing the job.
No you didn't ruin anything you simply weeded out someone attempting to sell you up the river for half price! One thing you guys better get used to doing is walking away and "missing out"! Why would you want to do the same amount of work if not more but make less than you deserve?
I usually say something along the lines of this "Based on our conversation and the responsibilities of the role, I'm confident I can bring a lot of value to (company name). I'm currently targeting roles in the (Pay Range) range. I want to ensure this is in line with your expectations for the position before we continue." Bringing up compensation early makes sure that you and the recruiter are not wasting each others time.
I asked once and they flat out told me they don't know yet. WHAT. Best to ask and know to move on.
Ofcourse you should ask. You need to consider if this job os the right fot for you. Its not just about them wanting you. Ive learned that through experience. If they get annoyed its because the recruiter is inexperienced or the salary is too low. Lol
If the company didn't include the pay range in their job post, you have every right to ask about compensation. It helps everyone prioritize their time.
If the recruiter had a problem with you asking, then you saved yourself a lot of time & you got your answer immediately. In fact, let me respond for her, "Not enough. In fact, my pay is based on the quantity of interviews I push through, not for the quality of candidates I screen that make it past the probationary cooling off period." It's doing everyone a favor to get that out in the open so as to not waste anyone's valuable time.
With that said, a general rule of thumb, coming from someone who has had a hand in both contract recruiting & workforce development, is if the Job Posting has a salary range -- you can guarantee you're looking at within that salary range...with extensive experience, you can negotiate up to the higher end of that range, but you will NOT, in almost all cases, be successful in securing above that range. If you intend on negotiating for that upper tier of the range, you'd better come with your guns-a-blazing & be able to prove why you're worth the higher-salary. In essence, that is their budgeted amount for that role. If the range was provided in the Job Posting, then a recruiter might seem annoyed because there are tons of candidates that might apply & not even read the Job Post, or think that they might be able to receive or push for a higher salary than what is posted, etc.
In our job market...if a Job Post doesnt have clear expectations regarding compensation for the work they're requesting, this is a huge red flag...either they want to wait to try to sell you on how great & easy the job is before telling you its a commission-only gig, or they know that their budgeted range is not the most competitive within the market, which wont attract even the most ambitious & desperate candidates -- they know that. Why would someone come & put forth the same amount of effort for peanuts when every other company is paying an all you can eat buffet? There's always a chance the recruiter forgot to include salary range on the Job Posting, but that's just too bad, I don't have time to bother with those, since experience has told me that 9 out of 10 times, it's not a mistake...there's always a reason & it always becomes obvious once you hear the pay rate -- & cringe....
On a final note -- if the Job Posting provides a single dollar amount as the compensation, and during the interview you are asked what your salary expectations are if offered the position, it is safe to assume that the amount provided is generally in the lower end of a salary range that they have budgeted for the role. It is NOT unreasonable or even unexpected to respond with a range as opposed to the posted amount...the wisest thing to do, in my experience, is to be willing to take the risk of shooting slightly below the posted amount, by providing a range that is about $5k below and above the posted amount. Example, Job Posting says $65,000...you say $60k - $70k...but ONLY if $60k is truly your bottom line. Make sense?
If the employer didn't put the salary range in the job advert, then you didnt do anything wrong to ask your wage☺️ I think thats one of the things you should know before you start your employment.
It's possible they got upset because they know it's low, and everytime an applicant asks, they walk away and the recruiter is tired of it. It's on them IMO.
Yeah, I would bring it up, and it's weird that the recruiter didn't do it. The last company I worked for, we would bring it up, cause we didn't want to waste time interviewing someone who wouldn't accept the job even at the top of our starting pay range.
BTW, the job didn't pay a ton for what you were being asked to do, so having someone say they wanted $5k higher was not indicative of them being 'too choosy'. But that was the budget we were given, and we were lucky we were actually told we could hire an extra person :(
Asking about compensation isn’t wrong, but timing matters. Early screening calls are often about mutual fit, motivation, and whether there’s enough interest to move forward. Leading with pay can unintentionally come across as transactional before rapport is built, even if that wasn’t the intent.
I think this is the best time to bring it up. I wouldn’t read too much into it…it’s part of their job that they expect in these intro conversations
My question is, if asking about compensation offended them is that the environment you want to work around?
If they were offended then they probably trying to lowball you. Try to get a range before an interview that way you'll know if they're wasting your time.
A screening is when it should be spoken about. Why move forward if they cannot afford you!?
Idk how hard up for a job you are, we are strangers on the internet. That being said you have a right to know what you're making and if they can't, don't, or won't tell you the wage/salary then it's not a job you want. They aren't going to value you or your work. You can do and I hope you find better.
It all depends “how you brought it up”. Being a hiring manager, wording is key. But either way, you do have a right to know and some states require employers post a range for the role so a lot do now in general.
You didn't do anything wrong. Communication goes both ways. If in any way you were given the impression they were not aware of that - count your blessings you didn't waste any more time on them.
Your time is valuable... even for an interview that might result in an offer you cannot afford to accept.
I couldn’t have said it better myself
I consider it a red flag if a salary range is not posted. Any employer should at minimum have an idea of what the compensation range is for each role they are hiring for - before they post the open positions and job descriptions in a public space. And if they don’t, they shouldn’t be interviewing candidates in the first place.
Salary range should be included out of respect for everyone’s time and so everyone is on the same page. It is best practice to be transparent.
And that is the point of a “range” - qualifications and experience determine high or low end of the range. They shouldn’t be making excuses as to why they cannot provide a salary range. If you qualified for an interview, then you should fall somewhere in the range.
If your question surprised them, if they were not forthcoming or transparent, and if they were putting it on the candidates to *have* to ask, then they should have anticipated and expected the question. If they did not, they don’t know what they are doing and maybe they should be looking for other jobs themselves. You were right to ask.
Good for you for still applying though they withheld info (for whatever reason), and good for you for interviewing. If they ultimately couldn’t give you even a salary *range* on an initial screening or interview, as mentioned above, sounds like you dodged a bullet.
May have been sales role disguised as salaried role.
Delivery is key. Did you start the call immediately snd say “my expected comp is $x, let’s not talk more unless you agree?”
IMO it should come up naturally. If the recruiter brings it up first then great. If they don’t I’d usually save it until the end when they ask if I have any other questions.
Exactly. Or something like "I want a fair wage and believe it is X". Market doesn't care about OP's definition of fair.