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How early is too early to ask for a raise?
Have an offer at Citi for 120K as an AVP in the NY office. Currently making 92K at my current role. Is this a fair offer? I currently WFH pretty much full time at my current role but it seems like this one requires 2-3 days in the office - and this is something I’m very hesitant about. Thoughts on how to approach this?
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If you ruined your chances, so be it. That just means something better is on the horizon. If they won't share comp, in my experience, then it probably isn't even worth your time or energy.
You didn't do anything wrong by asking. Some recruiters and hiring managers simply choose to be offended over candidates asking for clarity on the only reason they work in the first place. We aren't looking for jobs as a hobby, we are looking for jobs in exchange for money, and we should be able to know without issue what kind of money we are looking at.
Exactly this, I was encouraged to go for an interview with a company who didn't give their salary/benefits package details, got a second interview, the manager I would have been working for was excited to have me come onboard. Then their HR said they couldn't match my salary and benefits expectations and gave the role to someone else. That person lasted 3 months before their old company ",bought," them back. Then HR had the cheek to contact me and told me they'd match what I wanted.. told them no, if I wasn't right and worth it the first time around I didn't want to join them.
Four rounds of interviews have been conducted without any compensation discussions. This is an anomaly. The market is upside-down these days.
Why not assume that they really have a blind spot to people's need to know what the compensation is ?
It doesn't matter how polite you are the reactions will be the same because these are questions they do not want to answer 🙃 🙂 😒 🙄
Like most things in life, it's not "if" you brought it up, but "how" you brought it up. You didn't share how you asked about pay. That may be the key to why the recruiter reacted the way they did.
Compensation is discussed during the screening call at most reputable companies. They too do not want to get in the weeds without there being alignment around salary and benefits.
I've always been told never bring up money. Let them bring it up. If it's less than what you expect then you will have a choice either to accept or not.
I've been told this too and honestly think it's the wrong way. The entire reason you applied and are there for the interview/screening is to exchange your time, energy and particular skill set for money point blank period, it 100% NEEDS to be brought up by them or you doesn't matter everyone knows you're not there to work for free. My experience is if they get annoyed and you end up accepting because you need something you always get the shit end of the stick from them regardless of how good and or efficient you are. Definitely need to learn to walk away from these types of people/companies.
I don't think you did anything wrong. I always ask about compensation especially if it's vague or based on region.
You did nothing wrong. The major Recruiting Agencies like Robert Half, Insight Global play games. Most times they lead you on to think they have something when in reality, they are new recruiters trying to build their contact list. They are more interested in our references they are with finding you a job. Most likely, they never had a position available which is why when you asked about the recruiter about the pay, they appeared to be annoyed. I have had better luck with "the foreignors that call me. They usually have real opportunities. They are a little pushy but the produce results.
I suspected I got played by the screener when she asks for expected salary which I declined to give as it's too early in the process. Next she asked about my last drawn which I gave unconsciously and she asks if I will work within range which I replied sure. Thereafter I was rejected and my friend who referred me says likely my expected is too high. Then it dawn on me, I got played. HR is terrible there days.. they cant seems to deal with professional conversation entraps candidate as part of their filtering process. Of course not all HR are such but I hear too many to wonder.
This is why I always assume any job where renumeration is not mentioned in the employment advertising is not worth my time & any organisation unwilling to be forthcoming when asked is not worth applying or working for. If they can't even be honest and open about potential income then what else are they hiding.
I agree that delivery definitely matters when asking but as a general rule definitely not rude, it's an essential deciding factor when working out if a job is worth your time.
Your feelings are valid, tbh... I prefer discussing these matters early on, as it ensures alignment on job expectations and clarifies deliverables within the company. This also allows for a stronger basis to request a raise when job descriptions change.
You have every right to inquire if the salary or wage rate isn't disclosed up front. Sounds to me like a rookie recruiter that should respect your position and just answer the question.
I think the best way to work it into the conversation is to say what is the salary range for this position so we don’t waste either of our time. This approach has other incredibly well for me.
No it’s not rude!! You should know what the the pay is before starting! If they don’t offer the amount you should ask!
You are doing everyone a favor asking this early on. I'm not working for entry level pay unless it's an entry level job either. Some companies think they can pay minimum wage for a job requiring advanced degrees and experience. If I wanted that I'd work for Wal Mart with 0 stress and near 0 expectations.
Set the stage. Is there a place where the salary is mentioned? No? Okay you looked at the JD, announcement, listing? It's no where. Fine you can ask. Stipulate that it was no where you could find. That should be fine.
Remember, this is your future. It's not top secret. This is private sector, NOTHING is top secret. Only the government is top secret. Yes, there are trade secrets and proprietary. Salaries are not, though any recruiter may argue.
So I have dealt with recruiters and told them I want to know the salary, and the company and a few other things. If they don't divulge the salary I say I'm not interested. I also look for benefits and location. If it is not worth it for me, I turn them down. If they want to play ball fine. If not they called me and showed interest first. If they really want me then they will play ball. If it is just a fishing expidetion, I jack.
Now I will let you in on a past procedure which was a best practice. I worked a lot of temp jobs and dealt with recruiters a lot. Used to be they told you nothing about the job except the title very sketchy description maybe hours if you were lucky. Nothing was ever said about salary. Reasoning for this the first to mention a salary range "lost". You'd say $10/hr. Then they would say we are only paying $8.50/hr. Good day, and the interview ends. Give you a handshake and send you on your way. If they say, $8.50/hr, you can say, I'm looking for $10/hr, thanks for your time. You see how it worked? In this economy I have been cutting to the chase. I just want clarification, and verify the salary and if indeed it changed. I wouldn't put it past these people to bait and switch. So I nail it down. Does this cut down your chances? I don't think so. You also want to make sure you are not wasting your time. Maybe you have a mortgage or a wife, or kids. Good luck. If they think you rude let them, just because the HR is the gatekeeper, doesn't mean they hold all the cards. You hold a few too.
Actually this is a law in the state of CA, so salary transparency is 100% within your right. Many states follow the same laws, so if you are in a state with salary transparency, and the salary range isn't posted, that's a big red flag in general about the company's overall policies, adherence to compliance and ethics.
Most companies are paying too little to there employees. And need to raise your dam wages....
You did nothing wrong
You did nothing wrong. If they’re annoyed, it’s the wrong company for you.
Never bring up compensation that early. A big red flag