{ "media_type": "text", "post_content": "In a meeting I said, “creatives can be savages sometime.” because of their unruly behavior towards internal teams, pushing deadlines, or throwing tantrums. I was called out and chastised by a junior creative for using the word “savages” in an unacceptable manner because the word is slur to non-whites in a zoom meeting. I am a BIPOC creative.\n\nAm I the asshole?", "post_id": "6150d88080236e002af8fb47", "reply_count": 114, "vote_count": 8, "bowl_id": "5565cfca8b2b9a03009acf57", "bowl_name": "Advertising" }

In a meeting I said, “creatives can be savages sometime.” because of their unruly behavior towards internal teams, pushing deadlines, or throwing tantrums. I was called out and chastised by a junior creative for using the word “savages” in an unacceptable manner because the word is slur to non-whites in a zoom meeting. I am a BIPOC creative. Am I the asshole?

likefunny
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Context matters, as does the audience. I could see how that phrasing would be borderline in this scenario. I could see myself saying something like that with good friends, but I wouldn’t use it where old school execs who might have no problem with the Washington football team’s old name could see it as micro-permission, for example.

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I’m old. And white. But I also know history. The term is in the GD Declaration of Independence, and it’s used as a racist slur “He has excited domestic Insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the Inhabitants of our Frontiers, the merciless Indian Savages, whose known Rule of Warfare, is an undistinguished Destruction, of all Ages, Sexes and Conditions.” Don’t say “savages”

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In response to your original question, yes. Why? Because: 1. You work in advertising 2. Advertising attracts a wide swath of personalities 3. That swath includes creatives 4. You are freelance, thus your continued employment is contingent upon others' positive perception of you 5. Name calling is not a desirable tactic in winning new or expanding current work Do I need another example?

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I’ve been agreeing with plenty of people. I’m entitled to express an opinion after a yes/no question. But “arguing” against a yes when the majority of yeses are your prickly yes comments. You’re entitled to express whatever you want in whatever manner you see fit and I’ll respond in kind. If you take a look at the entire thread people have differing opinions. It’s definitely not me against the world.

likesmart
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It's only acceptable if you follow it up with, "classy, bougie, rachet."

likefunny

I appreciate this reply.

People need to relax.

likesmart

Try telling that to today’s social justice warriors

likesmart

Imo? No, you are not. Not the junior's fault either, they were brainwashed to become this way. Self-righteousness is a helluva drug.

likefunny

Happy to use words like: wild, disobedient, refractory, and lawless. I’ll just use savage sticker on Instagram only because internet slang.

likefunny

I don’t care who the audience is. Never resort to name-calling. It’s not only unprofessional, it’s plain wrong.

likefunny

Well said, CD2. I think the constant rebuttals say a lot about character here. OP saying you’re making assumptions (everything you said was factual, referring to a department “creatives” in front of colleagues “people on the call”) and completely missing the point while making their own assumptions in the same exact sentence. The irony is mind blowing. Seems they’re seeking validation rather than actually willing to learn here. Hopefully it’s just a lack of experience.

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Been there. Lost that. It's not worth arguing over or reasoning with, really. I just use "unruly" now. No one is offended by that one yet. But it is a word that isn't rainbows and butterflies, so in time, someone will be.

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😜

Im actually part Indigenous... In the context you used it in.. no. Now if you had of said you were the one to come up with Dior’s 2019 Sauvage campaign.... I would of said you lost your damn mind lol

likefunnysmarthelpful

You have to look at intention. Are you talking to a racist at a trump rally with a MAGA flag or a decent human being and co worker who maybe accidentally said something you thought was offensive? If you’re creating a gotcha culture then people won’t be open and actually making progress.

likehelpful

The primary use of savage as a *noun* is in the derogatory sense, so… it’s not unreasonable for the junior to hear it that way.

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I understand the difference between a noun and an adjective, thanks. I thought the song said “I’m savage,” (as an adjective), so my mistake there. But when someone refers to people as “savages,” I absolutely think of the noun definition first.

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Savage is fine. That’s what we call hungry wild pack of dogs, lions etc. But don’t call out creatives for pushing deadlines etc. too often account and strategy are to eager to bend over.

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Thankfully have not witnessed this. My bp just rises.

Micro micro aggression

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You’re not an asshole. Just say “thanks for that perspective, it hadn’t occurred to me” , and move on

likesmart

Isn’t “savage” common cool kid slang these days? Megan Thee Stallion also has that recent “I’m a savage, classy, bougie” song.

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Never heard of a micro-permission before.

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@mccann1 add it to the lexicon!

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I try to use adjectives instead of nouns and describe actions instead of using labels. This is just one example… Me: “That sounded kinda racist.” Them: “I’m not a racist.” Me: “I didn’t say you were. I said what you said sounded that way.” And then I regurgitate what they said in the context of how they said it. I’m a white dude, though. Those are my own personal ways of navigating things. May not be the best way.

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Maybe.

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NTA

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Anyone who's espousing the perception of creatives being savages, or allowing them to behave as such, is indeed antiquated.

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I went into this thinking “not the asshole” but some of the comments in this thread in support of the OP were able to firmly change my mind. Thanks!

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Yes

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NTA. This reminds me of an episode on the Good Fight when a student sued a professor for using the word "niggardly" because it sounds like the n-word. I suppose the PC way to say this would be "creatives can be real mean."

funny

Junior is Asian. I’m biracial. I agree that America and American English is becoming less pointed, passive, which leads to less colorful language. While I understand that it’s a great move to be respectful, antiracist, and overall sensitive. There’s a point to be open minded, but so open minded where one’s mind falls out of one’s head. That’s where I’m like, “ok, am I losing my mind?” I had a friend from outside of the US, ask me, “why are Americans so sensitive on race? It gets in the way of getting work done.” It was a good perspective to understand that the US is extremely focused on racial equity whereas other places understand racism, but put it aside to move forward with conversations and process. I honestly have to agree with a lot of your points @creative1

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