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You are correct that it is crazy. Among other things, the maintenance in a coop may be covering the cost of a coop mortgage, on top of the individual owners mortgages. And the coop mortgage never seems to have favorable terms - it’ll be something like 8% locked in years ago with prepayment penalties.
1) Look at condos. The listing price may be higher but monthlies normally more manageable and you don’t have to deal with crazy boards
2) If all the places with reasonable maintenance have prices out of your budget, you need to rethink your search parameters. Either consider a smaller / lower-amenity building or a different neighborhood. Or maybe keep renting.
To be fair, the high maintenance is also probably what leads the unit to be discounted to only 700k - which is pretty low for even a 1br in Manhattan let alone 2br
Enthusiast
OW 1, agreed. I’d even take a 1.5 BR (office type space), but it’s still hard to find something beyond select options, in few locations, with the lowest end of sq. footage. The mortgage + fees (sometimes higher than the mortgage) limit my options to what feels like slim pickings.
A1, this too. When I find the right pricing, I realize there’s a land lease and it’s up within the next 5-10 years (so fees subject to change within the few years).
I’m willing to bet you’re finding those units on the east side between 40th and 70th - that area is notorious for land leases, absolutely bonkers mortgages on the buildings, sketchy constructions histories, deadbeat tenants (the un nearby) and wildly expensive maintenance fees. That’s why the $2m apartments are priced at 700k, they can’t sell it.
A true 2bd 2bath in the city should start at about 1.2-1.5, and carry between 2-3k in maintenance.
Enthusiast
PwC 1, precisely! And that’s exactly why. It’s infuriating.
Have you checked out Housing connect?
Enthusiast
EP 1, I’ve never heard of this. Googling now!
I just bought a 2B1B in a coop earlier this year. I would recommend filtering by maintenance fees when talking to a realtor. Mine was approx 2k (downtown Manhattan), and while that was still higher than I wanted, it was way more digestible than the 5k ones you mention.
Enthusiast
AD 1, I didn’t realize this—that’s definitely helpful to consider/look into. Thanks!
Maintenance + taxes in Manhattan can be more than a whole mortgage in Brooklyn.
Enthusiast
Seriously!!
What’s your income range? Could qualify for the apartments that are set aside for median income etc
Enthusiast
I’m usually btwn $200-250k by year end, which feels like it’s below median at times, but I’ve only seen listings like that for $100k or less.
Hah yeah I’ve seen a bunch like that in midtown. I read somewhere to check whether properties are on a land lease since whoever owns the land can charge whatever they want at the end of the lease, so it’s very unfavorable. I think in general the co-ops themselves can be considered in good or bad financial health, which ultimately leads to maintenance fees… the land lease thing is usually a main cause of crazy maintenance fees from what I understand, but can be just the management company hired for the co-op.
Enthusiast
Precisely see this! I am all too familiar with land leases now and it’s just insanity. I’m not ready to leave, but hard to stay if you want to buy and not rent perpetually.
Rising Star
Honestly that sounds like a massive exaggeration. The only way it could get even close to that is if it was a land lease building (in which case I’d stay away from anyways)
Enthusiast
There’s actually a lot worse, if you search around on property sale platforms. Do you mind sharing the neighborhood you’re in? Desperate for better deals in manhattan, if I can find them!
I live in a luxury doorman building in gramercy with only a 1.1k per month fee (1 br, 700k). Low fee buildings do exist
Enthusiast
This is honestly the best deal I’ve heard of this far. Sometimes the fees, collectively, far outweigh the mortgage and it’s nonsensical to me.
This is why I bought in Jersey City.
Pro
I’ve considered doing the same. How much is your monthly maintenance fee?
Definitely worth making monthly charges a major filter in your search. I just don’t get the point of “buying” a place only to enter into the obligation to pay something close to market rent just for maintenance and taxes. And while the market price does adjust somewhat for maintenance costs, my gut feel is that it under-adjusts.
We wound up buying a 3BR in Brooklyn with maintenance under $900. No doorman or luxury amenities but love the apartment and neighborhood, and the monthlies give me no headaches.
If you do consider NJ, keep in mind that while prices and maintenance may be lower, property taxes can be a lot higher. I don’t have numbers offhand but that was my recollection.
I’m in Park Slope actually. The price was not cheap (over 1.4m) but the monthlies are pretty low. They rose a bit just recently but still under 1000.