Are you guys willing to quit over a RTO mandate? Remote work is the only thing keeping most of us from a total breakdown. I see these articles about firms mandating 4 days in the office, and I honestly think they’re trying to trigger a mass exodus. Saving two hours a day on a commute is the difference between me exercising and me eating a bag of chips for dinner in my car. If I can do my research and drafting from my couch, why do I need to sit in a cubicle just so a partner can see my presence?

likefunny
Posting as :
works at
You are currently posting as works at

100% I did just that! I manage a global team so 90% of my meetings are on Teams. My company was trying to force me to move for 5 days on site. I refused; my boss and I basically got management to agree I would stay on remote until my boss could find my replacement. Meanwhile I found another job, fully remote, same salary and would allow me to relocate to another state. Leveraged that with my CEO and now have full approval to move, stay remote, same salary.

likesmartfunny

Very nice

I haven’t actively been in an office since 2021. And, I’m open to hybrid if it’s like 2 days a week. But, I’m full remote. I’ll take a pay cut to stay fully remote as well. A round trip commute for me would be 1.5-2.5 hours depending on traffic. And, the rent in the area of most law firm near me is 3.5+ for a studio. That’s a no for me.

likefunny

Yes. I’m a senior associate and can do my work without colleague interaction (or at least do it remotely). Partners have no qualms with calling me remotely at 9pm; the same should be true at any other time of the day/week.

like

Apparently not, but not for lack of trying. I have been looking for a remote job for 4 months and no luck yet. I was more productive, and a significantly happier person overall when we were remote.

like

I recognize the value of interacting with colleagues in an office environment, so no, I wouldn't quit over that. I've learned an enormous amount from being around people. And that learning by osmosis couldn't be replicated while I was working remotely. If being remote is important to you, you should stick to your principles and quit if it's required. I see things quite differently, however.

like

Quitting over RTO makes sense if you’re reasonable certain you can land a comparable job with materially less in-person requirements (but even then, keep in mind that RTO policies are subject to change at the whims of management), OR you’ve already decided you don’t need the biglaw salary and were going to be stepping away anyway. Otherwise the reality is that most firms are moving in the same direction on office presence, and as a purely economic matter (i get you may have overriding considerations), quitting over RTO is probably a bad decision.

like

No. But i did switch to 90% so that my billable hr requirement is 1800 not 2000. That makes it more doable to do the commute and stuff, especially with a little one

like

Yes, I need time to calm my nervous system and hide from the current managing class of hostile lead paint victims and it also allows me to dodge sxl harassment when necessary, which it has been necessary many times!

Im not going to let it destroy my resume but it is high on the priority list for my next move and that will happen asap. If management wants connection and cooperation in the office, they need to adapt to the modern era and find ways to build community without putting insane pressure on those of us working 60-100 hrs a week. Entire Fortune 500 companies are completely remote.

The senior people WFH and when they were associates, things absolutely were not like this; so no, they did not do what they're asking us to.

likefunny

In the economy of 2021-24? Absolutely.

Today? Lol I'm a fed and didn't quit, so absolutely not. I can go to the private sector if I need to but it'll be for hybrid at best it seems.

Until the economy improves and job market improves I'm sheltering in place, despite how unpleasant this current job is

like

I would personally find another job (and would only ever recommend quitting after you’ve secured another job if you can at all help it) — I think in office presence really benefitted me as a new attorney, but now as a senior I really don’t need that level of help with development anymore and have the relationships to call people up when I do want help with something really tricky. And a “cubicle”?! Absolutely not.

likefunny

Were you in practice pre-2020? Because in-office was the industrywide norm before then, and for most of the offices in the South, it actually remained that way during covid. This whole WFH era is a really new thing, and it seems like there's a shift towards at least hybrid if not fully back in office.

Whether you decide to adapt or resist and find am alternate option is really a personal decision. I go through phases where I WFH for weeks on end, and then I go into the office for weeks on end, but I imagine we're at different stages of our career.

like

I think "mandate" should be taken loosely. Lots of firms say they require it, but it's not enforced. And the way it IS enforced is typically when it comes time for promotion or maybe bonus. In my experience, if you're productive, well-respected, and well-liked, no firm is going to fire or take other adverse action against you for rarely (if ever) coming in. Especially if you're not gunning for partnership. Different ball of wax if you're looking to lateral, as you obviously can't lie about your intentions and fewer and fewer firms are willing to hire for fully (or close to it) remote roles.

like

Out of curiosity, how many years did you work in a law firm before March 2020?

like

I would absolutely find another job if my firm enforced RTO for me. But I have the leverage to do so. I’m a Senior Associate with some of my own clients and function ostensibly as a Partner now. I’m fully remote and signed an offer that designates me as fully remote. I live far from the office. Firm announced 4-day in-office requirement and I assumed it didn’t apply to me. Thereafter, Office Managing Partner told me the office Partners talked with firm leadership and told them to leave me alone about coming in and nothing yet. We’ll see whether they hold it against me for Partnership promotion though. Would definitely take a GC role rather than start the clock for Partnership at a new firm.

likefunny

If you could get another remote position, why not? Seems important to you, so do it.

like

Most legal assistants don’t work as many hours as the attorneys do but just 2-4 hours (1 or 2 days) of not having to commute to work makes such a difference in attitude and production. Unfortunately, I only have 1 day WFH and I’ll be forever trying to get 2 days. When I come into work the next day I feel much happier and energized. Better work life balance and great mentally.

I’m learning quite a few would rather work remote because they are tired of the office politics and garbage that goes on inside the office and those that still do work remote are quite content and choose not to ever step back inside the office environment. However, on the flip side, we still need social interaction outside our own personal home office. However is that balanced? I can be just as content inside the house all days until grief strikes and I need human interaction.
I believe remote work is super great as long as it is balanced.

I would hope that most of us have friends and activities we like to do (not to mention family) who are/that are completely unrelated to our current jobs. Perhaps not just starting out in a new city, but otherwise

Related Posts

Ideas please:

I’m inheriting a “team” of siloed strong individual developers who are on different work streams and are very jaded and struggling with motivation. Most are contractors. They have legit gripes about the client, but I won’t be able to solve those without getting cross-discussions going with knowledge-sharing across our “team“. Any suggestions for remote team-building that won’t just be shrugged off with cynicism, or worse, ignored?

like

Is anyone’s wfh office chair getting less “springy” over time? Mine just doesn’t have the same umph it had before, constantly lowering throughout the day.

like

Does PayTM(Payment gateway team) allow permanent wfh?

like

Hi Fishes,
I have 1.8 yrs Exp and working in the Big data domain and have a few offers please help to decide on the comparatively better option based on salary, Work-life Balance, security, and Carrer Growth.

EY GDS: CTC 12 ( 11.20 Fixed )
Publicis Sapient: 16 CTC ( 14.5 LPA FIXED )
Neudesic (IBM) 16 CTC ( 14.5 FIXED + WFH Remote Complete )
PubMatic: 22.70 CTC + 2 lakhs Joining Bonus ( 16 fixed LPA + Other benifits, stocks, etc )

It will be very helpful if you can suggest with some reason.

like

Currently working as radiology access specialist that is a regular 10 to 6 Monday through Friday. I want to branch out to remote position in healthcare I have about 3 years of working administrative part of healthcare. This will be a second job in a sense. Does anyone have any ideas ?

like

£200 for WFH equipment , what are you fishes getting

Just got a job at Deloitte M&A in Atlanta and am currently looking to buy a house. Would you advise I buy closer to Atlanta or the suburbs? I personally want to be in the suburbs but I hear the traffic situation is quite bad. Current consultants in Atlanta, how much time do you actually spend in the office vs remote vs client site? Would you advise I try and stay closer to the office?

like
like

Hey FishBowl Friends, so I’m currently trying to break into tech sales/FinTech and I feel that due to my previous work history, I might not look like the ideal candidate on paper but I’m an extremely fast learner and very coachable. I’ve been a manger at a gym, got my degree in finance, worked as a client advisor at a top 3 auto dealer in the nation and now I’m a project manager at a solar company. I really want something that’s remote and steady, any recommendations on how to spruce myself up?

like

Hi,

Any idea about the C&SP department in comcast? working culture, WLB and all..

I was selected in Comcast for a developer role.. Will Comcast provide work from home?

so if anyone knows about that please share your thoughts.

like

Hi,
I'm looking for Manual Testing remote opportunities. Having 3.3 years experience and immediate joiner.

like

Hey guys!

Can anyone give me ideas for remote jobs that can be done at my own time?

I work 9-5 and i would love to work a remote job during nights and weekends...

like

I have an offer from DXC technology (7.5 fixed + WFH for 8 months) and 3i infotech (9.25 fixed + 0.75 variable). Can anyone help me to choose the company?
YOE - 2 years
Role - Data Engineer

like

Has anyone seen great examples of a hybrid work model and could they share their policies? our team would like people in offices to some degree but is also open to remote workers. I love the flexibility but in practice it can get messy without clear parameters.

like

Working remote with next to none human interactions, masking and social distancing in public. When will this end 😩

Post Photo
likefunny
like
like

BDO, I need some help~ What so you think about a remote position? Is there any huddle in progression if you are fully remote? What's next after MD?

like

More Posts

What's been your favorite suite of productivity tools generally? Do you prefer Office/Microsoft products, Google apps, or other alternatives?

like

Look for opportunities in other consulting firms currently hiring. Anyone hiring for someone with 3.5 YOE of which 1 year is of consulting for a big healthcare organization!

like

Here it is.

Post Photo
likefunnyuplifting
like
likehelpful

Does anyone feel a disconnect with friends who work a typical 9-5, or those who are non-entrepreneurial and/or never owned/run a business?

like

Currently having 12.36lacs CTC, YOE 8, Business analyst skill, other skills power Bi, SQl, SAP Hana, before 1st round informed recruiter expected CTC as 20lacs not aware BOnus included in IQVIA.

Now that i have submitted all the docs, waiting for HR discussion. My expectation is now 25lacs fixed. Can i say this now to HR when they call?

Ps no idea about grade. What is the scope for negotiation?

Hi Folks , ey hire for technical domain and then assign non technical projects. Does it happens with everyone or some people ?

And is there any way to shorten the 3 months notice period in ey ?

like

Persistent Systems Limited Hi all, Welcome to Appian Developers Group. You can talk about all things Appian here and discuss your doubts regarding the platform or anything related to it. Regards.

Accenture Accenture India Wipro Infosys Coforge Tata Consultancy Tech Mahindra HCL Technologies PwC KPMG Deloitte Deloitte India Deloitte Digital Appian Corporation Cognizant Persistent Systems Limited Persistent Systems CGI CTS CTS Corporation

like

Which is the best MBA school in India for experienced folks?

like

Hi Sharks,

I'm looking for referrals for a Technical Support Role. Currently working as a 'Senior Support Analyst' at Talisma, which is a CRM product.
I have over three years experience in Business Development and over two years experience in tech. I'm looking to change for better growth prospects.

Proficiencies : HTML/CSS, Javascript (Basic), Python(Intermediate), SQL(Intermediate), MS SQL Server, Unix(Linux), IIS

I am new here, so I'd really appreciate it if I get enough hearts to DM ppl.

like

Does SuitSupply do discounts if you buy 3 or 4 suits in one go?

I have accepted an offer for the role of Director of Data Science & Analytics and I'll be working with old colleagues. I am very excited. I haven't given notice yet because I am waiting for the background check to complete, but my boss just asked me about traveling to a meeting in November. I start at the new job Oct 25. I'm really struggling for how to respond. If I were not leaving it is absolutely a meeting I should be at. I don't want to respond with a lie. Any dvice on how to respond?

likesmart

Can someone help me with the in-hand salary?
I assume Its 1.24 including taxes. 20k is reserved for Performance pay, I believe they will atleast pay 50% i.e 10k per month.

Is this good offer for 4.2EOY?

Post Photo
like

Hey, I’m from Canada, and originally from London, UK

I’ve been in the tech sales industry for around 5 years now and am looking for a mentor to pick their mind in just experience, how they found progression, what they’d recommend and just a push as a whole

Is anyone interested in being a mentor at all?

like

Do they provide cab service in Gurgaon or reimburse it?

Do tech companies like FAANG hire strategy consultants? Starting at an MBB/T2 next year and curious if tech companies leverage consultants as much as other industries. Part of me wonders if they are in such high growth right now that consultants can’t add as much value, thus maybe a smaller presence. Thoughts?

like

Hi Guys,

Can I get some refferal for Cloud Automation fields : VCenter, Powershell, Azure...
Application Development : .net , C#, javascript, html, css...

Currently I am on notice period. With total experience of 3 years 10 months.

Also please give some idea of what CTC should I expect....

like

Friendly tip from a former recruiter & HR PM.

Under no circumstances disclose how much you make or what you want to make.

Tell the recruiter,” I need to interview to learn more about the specific details of this opportunity before I’ll know how much I need to accept a potential offer…”

I discuss & other do’s and dont’s on IG.

Post Photo
likesmarthelpful

Additional Posts in Law

Last associates committee meeting is coming up. Partners have asked each associate to come up with... not one... but FIVE marketing ideas. Other than reeling out “we offer competitive pay” in job postings, what are some good ones your firm does?

I’m struggling a bit. If I knew how to market well, I certainly wouldn’t be in this position.

like

Oil and gas attorneys what do you do?

like

Anyone here work in litigation for a few years after law school, and then leave to clerk for a federal judge for 2 years? If so, did you have any difficulty finding a job at a law firm for after the clerkship is over / did this set back your career progression law firm-wise at all?

like

Just had a hearing on my motion to compel where OC told the judge we hadn’t conferred before filing the motion. Not only did I attempt to confer on 3 separate dates, I attached the emails and his response that he refused to confer to my motion. Judge didn’t care, as soon as she heard him say we hadn’t conferred she denied the motion. Not asking a question, just needed to vent.

like

What’s the best way to turn down a 2nd interview? During the 1st interview, I learned that the compensation for the role is not within the range that I am looking for and requires 400 more billable hours a year than what I bill now. I’d basically be laterally for my current salary just to bill 400 more hours. I also wasn’t aware that the local office was strictly ID. Firm website advertises lots of practice areas. Any advice? TIA!

like

Family law litigator looking to transition to in-house? Any tips?

like

A friend was rewatching old episodes of Suits, which admittedly I’ve never seen. The main character starts at this law firm where associates are given cubicles not offices. There’s no way that’s accurate, right??? I have a cube but I’m just a lowly gov atty frm a state school LOL not a Harvard law alum at a reputable NYC firm

like

For those of you required to be in office- do people use the phone and email to contact you or do they still come by in person? People in my office seem not to understand how the phone works...

like

Hi new here. Idk what my value is and if I’m getting paid an amount that reflects my hard work. I am a paralegal for a small law firm (family and immigration) w only 1 attorney. I have about 20 files or more in my rotation at a time. I work on various types of cases at once. Some are simple, others are extensive. I feel like it’s very unstructured and one of the managers micromanages. It’s like every man for himself. Take home pay is $50k. I am working on my bachelors deg. Do I get paid enough?

like

What is the expectation at your firms about coming into work after making your billable hours requirement? Asking especially for those who do not get a bonus per extra hour billed over the minimum.

like

What is everyone’s: (1) billable hours this year; (2) practice group; (3) year; and (4) size of law firm?

like

What’s average salary in ID firm mid size (NY) about 350 attorneys ? Class of 2019 but was in public sector (criminal law) for 2 years! 2000 billable hours minimum

like

Big Law Dads: How much time do you usually take off when your wife has a baby? And do you actually get to take off, or do you just end up working from home half the time? My wife is due Mid-December, and I’m staffed on 4 M&A deals trying to close by year end, so it’s not looking promising.

likehelpful

Anyone at Pryor Cashman have intel on firm culture, work/life balance, and comp?

like

Well I learned my lesson. Never work with Wells Fargo. Any good banks I should switch to?

like

I feel like I’m wasting my time waiting on CA bar results 😭, any tips on how I can use this time effectively?

like

Any thoughts on Legility vs. Relativity in terms of eDiscovery software? Or is there another I’m not aware of?

likehelpful

Any advice on how to deal with a partner/boss who is shifting all responsibility to me with zero guidance, no mentoring, and an unwillingness to discuss the issues? (Small firm, only associate under this partner and have been working at the firm for 2 years). There are an increasing number of passive aggressive comments from the partner who expects to be completely hands off once the case lands on my desk. Wants me to figure it all out despite cases being from different areas of law.

like

Second year associate here. How should I deal with the one partner in my practice group who seems to exclusively give me lousy assignments that we’ll never get paid for? I get great work from everyone else.

like

Second year associate here who recently switched from litigation to corporate law. I am absolutely swamped while simultaneously having no idea what I’m doing ever and I’m feeling so burnt out. The partners are pretty great and feedback is constructive which I’m grateful for, but I’m so desperate for a compliment I’ve been saving any scrap of positivity in a folder 😭 it’s December 22 and I haven’t done my Christmas shopping because I don’t feel capable of thinking about it. I need a hug.

likeuplifting

New to Fishbowl?

Download the Fishbowl app to
unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.
That was just a preview…
Sign Up to see all discussions
  • Discover what it’s like to work at companies from real professionals
  • Get candid advice from people in your field in a safe space
  • Chat and network with other professionals in your field
Sign up in seconds to unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.

Already a user?
Login here

Share

Embed this post

Copy and paste embed code on your site

Preview

Download the
Fishbowl app

See what’s happening in your industry
from the palm of your hand.

A phone with Fishbowl app

Scan your QR code to download
Fishbowl app on your mobile

Download app

Sign up for free to view this conversation on Fishbowl

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use and Privacy Policy

Already have an account? Log in

Sign up for free to continue using Fishbowl

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use(New) and Privacy Policy(New)
Messaging rates may apply

Already have an account? Log in

For account settings, visit Fishbowl on Desktop Browser or

General

Legal