Ever notice how hitting your billables feels like running a marathon, but then you look up and realize the firm billed double (or more) for the same work? I’ll spend 8 hours buried in a research memo, hit my target, and then see the partner tweak a few sentences and bill another chunk on top. It’s demoralizing for associates and confusing for clients, who already assume we’re padding time. I get that this is “how the system works,” but it feels like the worst-kept secret in law. Do you think clients would actually trust us more if billing models were transparent?

likefunny
Posting as :
works at
You are currently posting as works at

It’s “demoralizing” and “confusing” to have a partner review and revise your work and bill for it?

like

I don’t think so. I think it’s just a really poorly written complaint about the partner billing too much for review.

like

I am not clear on what the issue is here.

like

Either this is ragebait, or associates have no idea how much work it takes to get work product client-ready.

like

On my matters, at least, it is more like the junior spends 10 hours doing research and coming up with something not client-ready, a mid or senior spends 2 to 3 fixing it, and then I spend less than an hour or maybe an hour to make sure it is right and to modify it as needed. Different types of work and deliverables vary but that is the general theme. There are times I have to spend a lot more, especially if just working with one associate, and especially if that associate comes up with something that needs a lot of fixes.

like

I think the OP is saying the Partner is billing more than it takes to tweak a “few” sentences.

like

You don’t like that they review?

like

Probably means you’re under billing and the partner is filling the gap between what fees were proposed to the client vs what you billed

like

Not sure what you are talking about, with respect. Yes, associate work is reviewed, and frequently is modified, if that is what you are referring to.

like

Biglaw is incentivized for lazy product

Associate sends to midlevel, midlevel puts comments, goes back to associate to enter, then goes back to midlevel, then goes to partner, then goes back to a junior, then goes to client.

It’s a secret for sure, and the sham biglaw is run on.

Now this is rage bait.

like

As with any system there's potential for abuse, but if a partner is putting his name on something going out the door, I imagine he's reviewing / analyzing the whole document. The fact that he only weeks of sentence or two doesn't mean he hasn't reviewed the whole thing.

There's also a consumer confidence aspect of this. Most people (especially those paying big law rates) want someone with experience and expertise was involved in their matter.

A .2 entry from the partner to review the work of a junior associate doesn't inspire a ton of confidence that the partner is really keeping an eye on things.

What you’re saying is unethical and should be reported to the bar and the client.

Start your own firm then.

Some of the previous “advice” is disappointing to see. Good for you for reaching out and trying to sort through conflicting emotions. You deserve to be supported rather than judged and chastised.

Of course you are experiencing conflict. It is a great thing that after all this time, there is a wonderful opportunity. This isn’t a binary choice! Give yourself credit for creating space to hold all your emotions. I’m sure (at least I hope) that we can all agree… feelings are not right or wrong things.

That said, I think you will feel more positive and less concerned about this change if you have a plan for how you will handle the absence. As has been pointed out, you may come to love having this time and space for yourself! Do you have family or friends nearby? Who is physically close by who can offer support if/when needed? Lean on your women, friends! You do not need to do this alone and you don’t need to figure it all out by yourself.

A4, what about this are you asking?

This means that you are doing good work if they only have to tweak a few sentences. That doesn’t mean they didn’t have to actually review your work. Even if they had no changes it might take awhile to read through and check your work.

Related Posts

I’m interviewing for an in-house brand position at a tech company... after 10 years in the agency world. Any big things to watch out for or ask? Thanks 🙏🏽

like

Anyone tried intermittent fasting? How long till you felt different? Is there a point where you should stop

like

How often do you all train abs?

like

Hi! Does anyone have experience training from a beginner to running a 5K?

I’m a pretty out of shape beginner, 24F, looking to run a 5K in February but not sure if that’s enough time.

I have an indoor treadmill to practice on but don’t feel safe running outside around my apartment, thanks.

like

With a recession around the corner - two questions:
1) will there be layoffs at Deloitte? My concern is we hired so much ppl this year.
2) will there be more work in org design? Just saw the Robinhood 9% workforce layoff announcement.

likehelpful

Anybody work in ethics and compliance? If so, what’s your current role and previous experience? I’m curious what my career path could look like in this area. I previously was in public accounting

like

What does it take to get promoted from Level 7 to Level 6 in the SAP Products stream?

like

PwC 🐠, I interviewed with the firm about 6 months ago for a Senior Associate position on the forensics team. I wasn’t extended an offer because the position was given to an internal transfer, at least what I was told. I tried reaching out to the recruiter I worked with last time but the email bounced back and wouldn’t be delivered. I was hoping to see / reapply if the group still was looking for seniors.

In your opinion, would it be best to reapply as a cold application?

like

Can two different recruiters submit you to the same place if they’re submitting 4-5 months apart? I’m not using both concurrently. Recruiter 1 submitted me to places in the beginning of the year and only one interview came out of it. Recruiter 2 wants to submit me to some places now. I’m wondering if there’s going to be any conflict/look bad etc if there’s an overlap.

like

Does anyone have any insights into what work at stack adapt is like?
And the general salary ranges there?

like

I keep on being asked ‘are you open to full time after this contract is over?’ Is this also common for you or is it just me and my role? 🤔

like

I was accosted last night at the bar when some guy overheard me telling my date I worked at Apple. Lots of expletives and "go back to where you're from" rhetoric. Do people really feel this way? So far, everyone I've met has been so welcoming.

likehelpfulfunny

What’s the average pay for room division coordinator?

like

What is the average salary for an Employee Benefits Account Manager? I’ve been in the industry 6 years.

likehelpful

Candid thoughts on the Ogilvy LA office?

Will Cognizant offer 35 lpa for 11 years exp. And senior manager role?

likefunnyuplifting

What’s a typical salary for a Director of Operations in the NYC area?

like

Currently working at Citi (C10). Would be completing 18months by Feb'23.

1-Can I directly apply for IJP 2-3 week's prior or do I need to serve notice in my current project?
2- Also can I apply directly for C12 level if required YOE is matching?
3- Within IJP can I apply for outside India?
4- What would be ideal appraisal % I can expect considering team size is small and best performer in my current project.

Thanks

like

Any other postdocs dealing with the crippling anxiety of disappointing all your mentors/supporters in science by leaving academia? I know it’s my life but….

likehelpful

Additional Posts in Law

Just had a hearing on my motion to compel where OC told the judge we hadn’t conferred before filing the motion. Not only did I attempt to confer on 3 separate dates, I attached the emails and his response that he refused to confer to my motion. Judge didn’t care, as soon as she heard him say we hadn’t conferred she denied the motion. Not asking a question, just needed to vent.

like

Advice Request: Started my career litigating. Switched to niche transactions (so about half and half at this point). Halfway through a year long sabbatical and reevaluating what I want to do (left before jumping to Senior associate). I’d like to get into litigation again in a practice group I don’t have experience in. Any suggestions on how to do this? How to approach firms and partners etc? Past 2 firms on my resume are top 30.

like

Rising 2L here…Just found out yesterday that one of my top target law firms is not participating in OCIs (they don’t have offices in my state). Any advice on the best way to move forward with them? Still planning to apply, just want to know what I should be doing. Thanks!

like

Anyone suiting up for the office?

I’m in Chicago, and I feel like I’ve been seeing a lot more suits in the loop.

like

Shout out to @nonequitypartner. We see you. Keep up the good work, and pls fix, thx.

likefunnysmart

Negotiating a settlement. I’m at $10k, opposing counsel is at $20k. My client won’t go higher than $15k. OC has come down to 17.5k and says his client won’t budge from that. Do I offer 12.5k so we can hopefully meet in the middle at 15k? Is that how the settlement game is played? Seems dumb we can’t just say let’s meet in the middle now and be done with this. (I’m a first year, first time negotiating a settlement on my own and I don’t want to screw this up!)

like

Well I learned my lesson. Never work with Wells Fargo. Any good banks I should switch to?

like

Anyone here work in litigation for a few years after law school, and then leave to clerk for a federal judge for 2 years? If so, did you have any difficulty finding a job at a law firm for after the clerkship is over / did this set back your career progression law firm-wise at all?

like

I am a federal government attorney (DOJ) with 2.5 years of litigation and bankruptcy experience. I want to break into tech companies/finance and apply for jobs @ Google, Robinhood, etc. Does anyone have any connections I can leverage?

funnylike

Is it okay to ask the recruiter if the salary quoted for the position offered to me is the cap or if there is room to negotiate? Not wanting to risk the offer going away so maybe best to not ask/negotiate?

like

Tips on discussing reimbursement for travel expenses during the “interview” process? I was invited to travel to a different state to discuss joining a firm. Should I even bring up the topic of expenses , or just pay my own way?

like

California 🐟 does your vacation payout when you leave your job get taxed at regular wage, or bonus, levels? Does your employer have discretion to choose?

like

How long did you have to wait from last round interview until offer? (Public sector)

like

Have a call on Friday with the CEO of an environmental entrepreneurship non-profit. It could lead to a professional opportunity and maybe even billable work I can refer to my firm down the line. I’m going in with an open mind but little concrete information on his entity and goals and ways I could get involved. What questions would you ask such a person?

like

Thinking about applying as a lateral to Quinn Emmanuel LA. Thoughts on hours, etc.?

like

How are 1st year litigation associates dealing with WFH? I’ve been having terrible anxiety/panic attacks, and pretty sure my billables wont exceed 110 for April. I’ve been super stressed about it and don’t know how to move on to May with the proper mindset to make up for as much time missed as possible. CA courts are still closed, and I’m worried I won’t be able to exceed (or even meet) my May goal after April.

like

Workout before (4:30 am) or after (6:30ish) work?

like

What is a reasonable pay increase? This will be my first pay increase. I make 70k now and will be starting my second year at big law. I had 3 years of prior experience before joining the firm.

like

Hi new here. Idk what my value is and if I’m getting paid an amount that reflects my hard work. I am a paralegal for a small law firm (family and immigration) w only 1 attorney. I have about 20 files or more in my rotation at a time. I work on various types of cases at once. Some are simple, others are extensive. I feel like it’s very unstructured and one of the managers micromanages. It’s like every man for himself. Take home pay is $50k. I am working on my bachelors deg. Do I get paid enough?

like

New to Fishbowl?

Download the Fishbowl app to
unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.
That was just a preview…
Sign Up to see all discussions
  • Discover what it’s like to work at companies from real professionals
  • Get candid advice from people in your field in a safe space
  • Chat and network with other professionals in your field
Sign up in seconds to unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.

Already a user?
Login here

Share

Embed this post

Copy and paste embed code on your site

Preview

Download the
Fishbowl app

See what’s happening in your industry
from the palm of your hand.

A phone with Fishbowl app

Scan your QR code to download
Fishbowl app on your mobile

Download app

Sign up for free to view this conversation on Fishbowl

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use and Privacy Policy

Already have an account? Log in

Sign up for free to continue using Fishbowl

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use(New) and Privacy Policy(New)
Messaging rates may apply

Already have an account? Log in

For account settings, visit Fishbowl on Desktop Browser or

General

Legal