Big firms have been posting their summer classes recently. I’ve noticed a troubling trend - firms want to “double count” diversity, so they hire many diverse women but very few diverse men. Anyone else notice this?

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This might also track with who is going to law school now. My 2020 class was mostly women so I expect women to make up more than 50% of summer associate classes.

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Yes, per the ABA, there’s almost double the amount of POC women as POC men in law schools right now.

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Are you complaining that firms are hiring black women?

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How many black men do you know going to law school? How many in private practice? It seems strange you are mad that black and brown women are being hired?

I really hope you consider your energy. I think more black and brown men should be attorneys but blaming the firms and drawing an us vs them with our lady counterparts is interminably weak.

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The issue is that "diversity" conflates gender and race. White women are very different than minority race men and women.

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I have noticed more women being hired in general - regardless of race/ethnicity.

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I’ve noticed that too. I would love to think it’s to make up for the lack of women at the top ranks (I.e. create a stronger pipeline) but year after year so many female senior associates get passed over and partner classes are predominantly white men.

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This is a ridiculous take and just goes to show being diverse doesn’t stop you from having biases of your own. OP, take a look at the discrepancy between male vs. female POC share partners (or in the C-suite, or boardroom, or any other conventional metric of corporate success) and get back to me on “troubling trends.” Hint: it’s way worse than the divide between male vs. female white share partners. Obviously all firms should hire more POC, but suggesting that they aren’t sufficiently prioritising hiring male POC over female POC is Ron DeSantis level idiocy.

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Didn’t think these comments could get worse but there is *always* a need to insult Ron DeSantis.

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I graduated in 2013 and my law school class (T14) was 52% women and out of the 14 black people we only had 4 black male attorneys smh.

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This probably tracks with other diverse groups. I just perused some firms’ NALP data. Some firms have like 3 to 1 female to male associate ratios for diverse attorneys and a 1:1 ratio for white associates.

Hiring a diverse women let’s firms hire more white men.

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Jesus, the misogyny in OP jumping out. If all you’re truly trying to say is firms should hire fewer white men, then why even bring up the comparison to POC women? Even if that is what you meant, you say above that “hiring diverse women lets firms hire more white men.” The implication being obviously that hiring POC women is somehow more problematic than hiring POC men.

You know what? All else being equal, we do tick more boxes than you. You know why? Because you have male privilege, and we don’t. By your logic, hiring a first gen POC associate or a queer female associate may tick more boxes than hiring a male POC associate. Are you going to just going to call any increase in hiring any diverse candidates who aren’t male POC a “troubling trend”?

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Once OP said “triggered” it was mask off.

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It's the same reason we always see women of color as leads in hollywood, but always opposite white men. fetish > equality

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I don’t understand what you mean by “double count.” If a firm has a summer class that is 100% women and 50% Black, they are not saying their class is 150% diverse. They will say 100%.

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Interesting. I tend to observe firms using white women to boost diversity numbers, then mixing up the ethnic diversity with men and women, so they are still predominantly white. I suppose they can use ethnically diverse women to double count, but this tends to happen only when they don’t want to hire women in general, so they “split the baby between WOC and white women to get the female numbers up without actually increasing their hiring of women in general or POC in particular. IMO law firms are terrible with actual DEI but instead focus more on gaming the system so they don’t have to achieve true diversity. If they don’t like hiring women in general, they’ll figure out a way to double count whoever they’ve hired. However, it’s very rare for the white women numbers not to exceed all POC combined. White women are still white, so they’re never really displaced in the order of priority. Even if they seem to be lower in Summer Associate numbers, actual offer letters, comp numbers and retention efforts will be focused on them on the back end and in some cases, POC will be aggressively trimmed at the mid level to position more white women for Partnership. It’s really about white supremacy in the end, so your energy is better spent advocating for more POC hires overall, not criticizing firms for hiring WOC.

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More women are apply to and graduating from law schools than men so I don’t think this is some unexplained nefarious conspiracy……

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Not that many more women. Also, my comment wasn’t even about the percentage of women. It’s the racial makeup of the male and female summers. Male summers are heavily white and female summers are heavily non-white. Are you saying that white men are smarter than non-white men but WOC are smarter than white women?

The way hiring works does a disservice to racially diverse men and white women. I know most people on this bowl don’t care about the latter, but I’m just pointing that out.

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Not a new trend.

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It's like my city council. The objective was to elect 50% female candidates. A noble objective that I fully support. After the results were announced, the organization supporting equal representation made headlines and boldly said, "We have achieved equality." So weird.

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