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Worked at Deloitte in the past.
Having worked with Deloitte USI, I think your job is safe
US jobs aren’t at risk. Indian associates don’t replace US associates, the supplement them. As we have less folks in the US interested in this profession we need to turn to other countries to supplement our workforce or the hours get even worse than they currently are. I manage 2 offices in India with about 80 people, if it wasn’t for them my seniors in the US would have needed to work 90+ hours per week all season instead of the 55-60 most of them were able to work. And those 55-60 hours were spent on projects they actually like doing and getting higher level experience. We’ve been trying to hire in the US. This year we couldn’t fill all of our open internships, let alone staff, senior, and manager roles. The labor market in India is tightening too, so be ready for other countries coming into the mix.
Those 1,000 tax jobs - Did you manage to hire 1,000 US tax associates in India this year? Because I can’t find them there. We don’t have as big of a footprint or name brand as PWC but I’d be shocked if you were able to expand your team in India by 1k of experienced folks in India. If you’re throwing that 1k off across all service lines then yea definitely. India developers and IT team members are way more cost effective and aren’t in as many client facing roles so those jobs are definitely permanently gone. No question with you there. But my experience hiring in India for US tax and managing the firm strategy for utilizing India for tax has shown me that headcount seems unlikely unless you replaced interns with inexperienced Indian associates that you’re training from the ground up. Not losing experienced and replacing with experienced.
The key here: learn a skill that is not replaceable - like ASC 740 or M&A/ITS tax. You’ll be more marketable against the offshoring rise
Tax compliance is a race to the bottom in fees, accounting firms will always look for cheaper ways to get the work done. Mainly done through investments in technology and offshore delivery centers.
Missed this earlier. But yes, once one started doing it they all jumped on board
Well maybe if they stopped paying poverty wages ( that is decent wages divided by tonnes of hours) then, the profession can be elevated and attract more people. I know IT people who make great money and work 40 hour weeks yearound. Read about new RN starting at $100,000+ per year plus overtime at 1.5 in NYC for a 36 hour regular week.. Just read an article of this 26 year old RN (travelling nurse) who made $250,000 last year. If you can't change the hours in public accounting, bump up the salaries to match or be competitive with other professions. Partners should share with wealth with the lower levels who do majority of the work. Trust me, elevate the salary levels commensurate with the tonnes of hours folks work and you will attract tonnes of people to the profession. People don't mind working hard if they are being compensated accordingly.
Crowe 1– totally. Clients see compliance as “gotta get it done”. Go into tax consulting (eg ITS). You bring real value (lower overall taxes paid) and the work is interesting. Even in tax consulting, some work is offshored to India or South America.
Does anyone have an estimate of the thousands of US jobs that have been lost over the years by US Accounting firms outsourcing tax compliance jobs overseas?
Coach
With accounting firms finding it harder to fill positions I don’t think it hurts much. It gives you more time to do more interesting work than compliance. Which lets be honest, most of us really hate.
This. My partner literally won a compliance engagement by bidding lower than a local firm and then told me the engagement is going to have a loss but it’s going to be a relationship builder to win more profitable work in the future.
Yes. No new hires in my group and when someone leaves they are replaced with someone offshore.
Excellent question EY1.
Has anyone experienced the quality and hours of the india offices? Spoiler alert. The ones I’ve heard about usually have incredibly high hours and do it wrong
I’ve heard of firms still charging close to a U.S. staff for the hours, or clients getting upset to find out the staff working on their jobs are from India. Also not to mention it takes time for US staff to clean up their work. Idk I don’t think it’s something to worry about
I know at least one large financial firm that outsource their US compliance and provision work to Indian outfits. This firm still has US managers that do the review
It’s a complex matter.
Technically speaking, the “Indian firm” is a subsidiary of the US firm. They are essentially our offshore back office support center.
Might be a dumb question. But can you be a CPA if you aren't residing in a state in America?...
Yes.